Comments

Editor_101 wrote on 9/26/2019, 6:31 PM

"At IBC, even 16K compatibility has been mentioned by a lens manufacturer and I'm sure we'll hit 64K before I die."

I could see 8k+ resolutions used for VR 3D, but that's about the only home use I can think of that it wouldn't be a complete waste.

"Reading the specs of the Lumix DC-S1H, do note that it doesn't seem to have a global shutter "

No camera in its price range does, but I have never had issues even with my GH5. Vegas has rolling shutter correction as well.

" I wish magix would do the same for vegas."

Two things...

1. Magix is a software-only company. BlackMagic is a much larger company that also sells hardware and can afford to put larger resources behind the development of software it can afford to almost give away for free in order to promote its hardware. The problem there is, Resolve is slowly transforming into something that works best with BlackMagic's gear, rather than being a industry standard NLE regardless of what you use.

2. It is better for Vegas to release bi-tri monthly updates that are well tested than to crank out a new update every few weeks that breaks more than it fixes, especially when new features get introduced by these updates.


Large resolutions can be useful for movie theatres, huge video billboards, etc. The higher rasters have a place. I can totally see someone buying a 64" 6-8K television for their home, for example.

As screen sizes get bigger, the higher rasters make more sense.

No, it doesn't make much sense for a PC monitor or smaller television, or a smartphone screen :-P

BMD has been going further and further in divorcing Resolve from super-rigid hardware requirements. For example it can display video full screen on a separate monitor without a BMD video card now, and a few other things.

I wouldn't be surprised if ASIO and other things come in Resolve 17, or even an update to Resolve 16 down the line.

MAGIX barely develops their software. VEGAS is actually one of the packages they own that gets developed the most, these days. Software like Samplitude doesn't really get developed heavily, for example, and many of the plugins MAGIX bundles with their pro software (eFX, Vandal, etc.) haven't been updated in any major way in 8-12 years.

VEGAS is doing about as well as it would have if Sony had kept it, so there isn't "too much" anyone can complain about that.

But it still has to compete with packages that are more aggressively developed, and sometimes at lower price points.

fr0sty wrote on 9/26/2019, 7:20 PM

"VEGAS is doing about as well as it would have if Sony had kept it, so there isn't "too much" anyone can complain about that."

I couldn't disagree with this statement more... Sony pretty much left Vegas to rot while the competitors raced ahead adding features like robust GPU accel, motion tracking, pro color grading, etc... which is why it has taken Magix 3-4 years to start to catch up to everyone else. Now they have the best HDR implementation I've seen, their audio is still light years ahead of Resolve even though they haven't touched it in years, their format support is as well, so is their scripting support, and there's a lot of areas where Vegas had been lagging for a long time where they now compete.

Other NLEs being aggressively developed keeps Magix on their toes, and I'd say they're doing a pretty good job of keeping up, as well as innovating ahead of the others in certain ways. So, it's a win-win that these other apps are being developed so aggressively... and that Vegas is as well.

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Kinvermark wrote on 9/26/2019, 11:58 PM

+1. Anyone who thinks Magix haven't been very busy improving the software clearly isn't paying attention. Perhaps intentionally so. I believe there are a number of "contributors" to this forum who do not use Vegas, but only comment as some kind of weird intellectual game.

Wolfgang S. wrote on 9/27/2019, 11:26 AM

It is not the question at all, if the Vegas Team has done a great job - for example also with the latest update. No doubt about that.

But it is also legitime to request the support for new emerging formats. If you are not interested in new formats at all, fine for you. But why should that be important for the users who simply ask for support BRAW here?

The new color correction and the new grading tools makes a lot of sense with raw. Also with BRAW or ProRes raw. We will see what the Vegas team will do here in the future. As long as there is no support for BRAW in Vegas users have to churn to Resolve. Something that I would not like as a long time user and tester fir this great software.

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Kinvermark wrote on 9/27/2019, 11:38 AM

@Wolfgang S.

Are you talking to me? I don't have a problem with people making feature requests.

Wolfgang S. wrote on 9/27/2019, 11:54 AM

Not specifically to you. It is simply how we see here requests in general.

PC AMD 3960X, 24x3,8 Mhz * GTX 3080 Ti * Blackmagic Extreme 4K 12G * Atomos Sumo * QNAP Max8 10 Gb Lan * Blackmagic Pocket 6K Pro, EVA1, FS7

ProArt Studiobook 16 OLED (H7600, 12th Gen Intel) with internal HDR preview on the laptop monitor

Kinvermark wrote on 9/27/2019, 12:07 PM

Fair enough. It's difficult to achieve a balance between open discussion of a feature request and overt negativity. Often these threads seem to descend into Vegas/Magix bashing - which ruins the forum IMHO.

But I would say the moderation on this forum is pretty good really.

VEGASDerek wrote on 9/27/2019, 12:50 PM

Interesting conversation.

We have a very long backlog of format support requests which we would love to get to you and that include BRAW). The focus for our File I/O team over the last several released is to improve reading and rendering performance, which you all know. The reality of the matter is that without the current performance and GPU support work which we have been doing, many of these requested formats would been virtually unusable in VEGAS. We hope to get to work on new format support again in the not too distant future, but at the same time, we have a tremendous amount of code restructuring we still would like to do to improve general performance of VEGAS Pro.

With all that said, I do not want to discourage anyone from making a request for format support, even if it duplicates what others have requested. This will help us know which formats are in most demand at the moment and direct our efforts toward them.

Kinvermark wrote on 9/27/2019, 2:02 PM

OK. Native cineform and Avid (as mxf ) formats please. :)

wjauch wrote on 9/27/2019, 4:30 PM

I'll add Red R3d. Hasn't been updated to Dragon color which is out about 5 years now. No idea if more recent Red cameras are supported at all.

 

 

adis-a3097 wrote on 9/27/2019, 11:34 PM

I'll add Red R3d. Hasn't been updated to Dragon color which is out about 5 years now. No idea if more recent Red cameras are supported at all.

 

They are.

zdogg wrote on 9/28/2019, 2:12 AM

 

MAGIX barely develops their software. VEGAS is actually one of the packages they own that gets developed the most, these days. Software like Samplitude doesn't really get developed heavily, for example, and many of the plugins MAGIX bundles with their pro software (eFX, Vandal, etc.) haven't been updated in any major way in 8-12 years.

VEGAS is doing about as well as it would have if Sony had kept it, so there isn't "too much" anyone can complain about that.

But it still has to compete with packages that are more aggressively developed, and sometimes at lower price points.

Samplitude is great, there's not much further these programs can go, as emulators of multitrack tape studios, they get the job done and then some. Third party stuff is really easily obtained and implemented. I use the Slate plugins and drums, the East West Composer Cloud. I wish Vegas was as solid and with as slick an UI as Samplitude, I truly wish that. You want a bit more, there is Sequoia, but I don't know too many that feel any sort of lack with Samplitude. Your only real limitation is you machine you're running.

Video is MUCH more complex, many more formats, different ways of compositing, it's like 3d to audio's 2d. But I do wish that Vegas would implement that Samp Gui, especially range selection and manipulation, more flexible mouse and smoother, less glitchy, less squirrely timeline routines and reactions.

raul-c wrote on 8/3/2020, 7:59 AM

I think many people are disappointed that BRAW is not yet supported in version 18. Any word on when support for this format will be added?

fr0sty wrote on 8/3/2020, 8:31 AM

They've been pretty open about this all along. Some raw format support is being held up by the companies that make the codecs taking too long to approve the code in order for it to make it into the release build, in other cases, there was more important work on the video engine that needed to be completed before new format support could be added. No timeline on when it'll arrive, but it is actively being worked on.

Last changed by fr0sty on 8/3/2020, 8:32 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

Systems:

Desktop

AMD Ryzen 7 1800x 8 core 16 thread at stock speed

64GB 3000mhz DDR4

Geforce RTX 3090

Windows 10

Laptop:

ASUS Zenbook Pro Duo 32GB (9980HK CPU, RTX 2060 GPU, dual 4K touch screens, main one OLED HDR)

jim-helpert wrote on 8/3/2020, 8:50 AM

Vegas Pro desperately needs better codec support.

ProRes Raw or 10bit 4:2:2 h265 codec support should have a higher priority than (IMO gimmicky) AI coloring or "sketch" effects.

fr0sty wrote on 8/3/2020, 8:53 AM

They also require a LOT more time to implement, and in the case of ProRes RAW, are being held up by Apple's approval process.

Systems:

Desktop

AMD Ryzen 7 1800x 8 core 16 thread at stock speed

64GB 3000mhz DDR4

Geforce RTX 3090

Windows 10

Laptop:

ASUS Zenbook Pro Duo 32GB (9980HK CPU, RTX 2060 GPU, dual 4K touch screens, main one OLED HDR)

raul-c wrote on 8/3/2020, 9:16 AM

Vegas Pro desperately needs better codec support.

ProRes Raw or 10bit 4:2:2 h265 codec support should have a higher priority than (IMO gimmicky) AI coloring or "sketch" effects.

Yeah, those effects look so cheesy and any video with those effects applied looks 100% unprofessional.

fr0sty wrote on 8/3/2020, 9:24 AM

Vegas Pro desperately needs better codec support.

ProRes Raw or 10bit 4:2:2 h265 codec support should have a higher priority than (IMO gimmicky) AI coloring or "sketch" effects.

Yeah, those effects look so cheesy and any video with those effects applied looks 100% unprofessional.

Speak for yourself, I've used them in some music video projects along with other effects, and created some really cool looks.

I get you're salty about this feature not being ready, but none of those AI effects took anything away from the time it's going to take to implement RAW support. Overhauling the GPU support and video playback engine is what has been holding that up, but those 2 things are necessary in order to make the RAW support work without running at 1 frame per second and crashing every 2 minutes. That, and these third party codecs require participation from the third parties that make them in order to get approval, and sometimes that process takes longer than VEGAS' team would like them to, and there's nothing they can do about that.

 

Last changed by fr0sty on 8/3/2020, 9:26 AM, changed a total of 3 times.

Systems:

Desktop

AMD Ryzen 7 1800x 8 core 16 thread at stock speed

64GB 3000mhz DDR4

Geforce RTX 3090

Windows 10

Laptop:

ASUS Zenbook Pro Duo 32GB (9980HK CPU, RTX 2060 GPU, dual 4K touch screens, main one OLED HDR)

raul-c wrote on 8/3/2020, 9:59 AM

 

Speak for yourself, I've used them in some music video projects along with other effects, and created some really cool looks.

I get you're salty about this feature not being ready, but none of those AI effects took anything away from the time it's going to take to implement RAW support. Overhauling the GPU support and video playback engine is what has been holding that up, but those 2 things are necessary in order to make the RAW support work without running at 1 frame per second and crashing every 2 minutes. That, and these third party codecs require participation from the third parties that make them in order to get approval, and sometimes that process takes longer than VEGAS' team would like them to, and there's nothing they can do about that.

 

Thanks for your reply. I just hope we get official word from Magix as to the progress of Blackmagic Raw.

fr0sty wrote on 8/3/2020, 10:01 AM

@Cleven (comment hidden due to violation) Cool. You're violating the forum rules, so unless you stick to them, you don't be coming back here any time soon either.

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Last changed by fr0sty on 8/3/2020, 10:03 AM, changed a total of 2 times.

Systems:

Desktop

AMD Ryzen 7 1800x 8 core 16 thread at stock speed

64GB 3000mhz DDR4

Geforce RTX 3090

Windows 10

Laptop:

ASUS Zenbook Pro Duo 32GB (9980HK CPU, RTX 2060 GPU, dual 4K touch screens, main one OLED HDR)

alifftudm95 wrote on 8/3/2020, 11:48 AM

Questions:

BRAW is an exlusive RAW codec for BM camera right?

ProRes RAW in the other hand is somewhat universal RAW codec? Like Sony A7siii or Panasonic SH1 with Ninja External recorder ?

 

Never edited a RAW footage before, but I do see the demand in RAW is increasing day by day.

 

c.c @fr0sty

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E DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

F DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

G DRIVE HDD 1TB

Monitor: BenQ PD2700U 4K HDR

 

 

 

adis-a3097 wrote on 8/3/2020, 12:02 PM

Questions:

BRAW is an exlusive RAW codec for BM camera right?

ProRes RAW in the other hand is somewhat universal RAW codec? Like Sony A7siii or Panasonic SH1 with Ninja External recorder ?

 

Never edited a RAW footage before, but I do see the demand in RAW is increasing day by day.

 

c.c @fr0sty

ProRes RAW is Apple's own thing. There's also ARRI RAW, Sony RAW, RED RAW, CANON RAW etc...

alifftudm95 wrote on 8/3/2020, 12:28 PM

Questions:

BRAW is an exlusive RAW codec for BM camera right?

ProRes RAW in the other hand is somewhat universal RAW codec? Like Sony A7siii or Panasonic SH1 with Ninja External recorder ?

 

Never edited a RAW footage before, but I do see the demand in RAW is increasing day by day.

 

c.c @fr0sty

ProRes RAW is Apple's own thing. There's also ARRI RAW, Sony RAW, RED RAW, CANON RAW etc...

Ah I see, thenks ~

PC DEKSTOP

CPU: Ryzen 9 5900x

GPU: RTX2060 6GB

RAM: 64GB 3200MHZ

Storage:

C DRIVE NVME M.2 1TB SSD GEN 4

D DRIVE NVME M.2 2TB SSD GEN 4

E DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

F DRIVE SATA SSD 2TB

G DRIVE HDD 1TB

Monitor: BenQ PD2700U 4K HDR

 

 

 

Cleven-Brown wrote on 8/3/2020, 12:47 PM

BRAW is an open source codec. Any camera manufacturer or recorder can implement it into their hardware if they like. If has proven itself to be one of the most efficient codecs. It handles 4k, 6k, 8k, and 12k. What other codec on the market has that capability. Besides the codec lets not ignore the poor performance that vegas has regarding gpu performance. Davinci implements its gpu performance 2nd to none. Even if I did use prores it works smoother on davinci vs Vegas because davinci has mastered gpu acceleration. Vegas is so far behind the curve in its codec support and gpu acceleration capabilities.