Decoding/Encoding... hardware or software

Reyfox wrote on 8/9/2021, 12:37 PM

This is a question I've been pondering.

You have GPU's with NVENC or VCE, you have Intel CPU's with QuickSync, and you have just the CPU.

Which gives the better results for encoding and decoding? Is there a difference in video quality in encoding between QuickSync NVENC and VCE?

I know some have an Intel CPU with iGPU, but also use graphics cards. Why not use the iGPU?

My computer specs are in my signature, and I am using AMD VCE for rendering. I always like to keep informed on hardware for maybe future purchases.

Thanks!

Newbie😁

Vegas Pro 22 (VP18-21 also installed)

Win 11 Pro always updated

AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16 cores / 32 threads

32GB DDR4 3200

Sapphire RX6700XT 12GB Driver: 25.3.1

Gigabyte X570 Elite Motherboard

Panasonic G9, G7, FZ300

Comments

diverG wrote on 8/9/2021, 1:01 PM

Have both intel & nvidia available. Nvidia drivers latest, intel vga as supplied with motherboard. Later ďrivers do not function well with Edius my preferred NLE. Testing intel with magix vp18, there is no improvement using my preferred intel driver or the one recommended by vp18. For mp4 renders from vp18 vucoder is the way to go.

Sys 1 Gig Z-890-UD, i9 285K @ 3.7 Ghz 64gb ram, 250gb SSD system, Plus 2x2Tb m2,  GTX 4060 ti, BMIP4k video out. Vegas 19 & 122(194), Edius 8.3WG and DVResolve19 Studio. Win 11 Pro. Latest graphic drivers.

Sys 2 Laptop 'Clevo' i7 6700K @ 3.0ghz, 16gb ram, 250gb SSd + 2Tb hdd,   nvidia 940 M graphics. VP17, Plus Edius 8WG Win 10 Pro (22H2) Resolve18

 

Reyfox wrote on 8/9/2021, 1:29 PM

@diverG thanks for the reply! Did you notice and difference in video quality between the Nvidia and QuickSync?

What I am trying to get information on, is there a difference in video quality between using Intel iGPU, CPU or graphics card. Also, if there is a rendering speed difference. There are many options in building a computer, getting what works best with what you are using (or plan to use) helps in determining hardware purchases.

Newbie😁

Vegas Pro 22 (VP18-21 also installed)

Win 11 Pro always updated

AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16 cores / 32 threads

32GB DDR4 3200

Sapphire RX6700XT 12GB Driver: 25.3.1

Gigabyte X570 Elite Motherboard

Panasonic G9, G7, FZ300

diverG wrote on 8/9/2021, 2:01 PM

In my case rendering to mp4 within vegas specifying intel QSV renders shows little use is made of igpu when viewed in Taskmaster; 5% if lucky. Using the same file set Vegas, 8 minutes, edius 1 minute. Using vegas, nvidia about 1 minute, same with vucoder but this appears to use igpu. Edius uses about 70/80% igpu, whilst vegas makes better use of nvidia GPU. Have no experience with AMD. No crashes with either NLE.

Either files viewed on tv show no discernible difference. Comparing files via compositing show small differences File sizes are similar. I'm in 80's so eyes not at peak performance .

Sys 1 Gig Z-890-UD, i9 285K @ 3.7 Ghz 64gb ram, 250gb SSD system, Plus 2x2Tb m2,  GTX 4060 ti, BMIP4k video out. Vegas 19 & 122(194), Edius 8.3WG and DVResolve19 Studio. Win 11 Pro. Latest graphic drivers.

Sys 2 Laptop 'Clevo' i7 6700K @ 3.0ghz, 16gb ram, 250gb SSd + 2Tb hdd,   nvidia 940 M graphics. VP17, Plus Edius 8WG Win 10 Pro (22H2) Resolve18

 

Reyfox wrote on 8/9/2021, 3:43 PM

Thanks @diverG for your input.

And don't worry about your eyes, I am not too far behind you!

Newbie😁

Vegas Pro 22 (VP18-21 also installed)

Win 11 Pro always updated

AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16 cores / 32 threads

32GB DDR4 3200

Sapphire RX6700XT 12GB Driver: 25.3.1

Gigabyte X570 Elite Motherboard

Panasonic G9, G7, FZ300

Howard-Vigorita wrote on 8/9/2021, 6:34 PM

I haven't really seen any definitive quality trends myself (hardware vrs software) but I haven't had a chance to pick up the Magic lossless plugins yet. My conclusion so far is that the gpu drivers or Windows itself must have gotten better... based on my pretty clear and widely held perception that Intel qsv yielded the worse looking renders back when VP16 was current. But now, vce and qsv renders with VP16 (which has not been updated since then) looks like they're delivering top notch quality right up there with Magix MainConcept and followed closely by nvenc. My Quality Tables here.

Former user wrote on 8/9/2021, 7:17 PM

Gerald Undone uses and recommends NVENC technologies

He talks about NVENC at 10minute mark

RogerS wrote on 8/9/2021, 8:00 PM

You put decoding in the title but what did you want to know about that?

In Vegas there are some media that can only be decoded with Intel iGPUs or where NVDEC is unreliable. If you search the forum you'll see threads on this.

11th generation Intel CPUs can also do hardware decoding of 422 HEVC which is nearly unplayable on most systems. If you're just dealing with 8 bit AVC none of this matters though.

Reyfox wrote on 8/10/2021, 7:48 AM

@RogerS when buying computer hardware, you would want the best bang and most compatible with the software you have. Hence my reason about decoding/encoding and quality of the render

Some people here say they only use software to render, others hardware. Timeline playback, what makes it "smoother" besides going to Draft.

I know all of this is clip dependent, as with rendering out is depending on which settings you choose.

Newbie😁

Vegas Pro 22 (VP18-21 also installed)

Win 11 Pro always updated

AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16 cores / 32 threads

32GB DDR4 3200

Sapphire RX6700XT 12GB Driver: 25.3.1

Gigabyte X570 Elite Motherboard

Panasonic G9, G7, FZ300

RogerS wrote on 8/10/2021, 7:55 AM

I see, well for timeline playback, hardware decoding matters greatly. Unfortunately there isn't much data available to use to compare GPUs. You can see the https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/benchmarking-results-continued--118503/ results for a hint as to how they compare on a sample project (Average FPS).

I think the biggest difference is whether the file type is supported at all, as I mentioned above, so my next processor will likely be an Intel because it works well in Vegas and the hardware decoding seems to be the most advanced and reliable.

Rendering speed I care less about and do software x.264 rendering with Voukoder. The benchmarking results linked to above show the difference between different CPUs and GPUs for rendering. I don't see a clear winner here with QSV holding its own against VCE and NVENC.

Reyfox wrote on 8/10/2021, 8:31 AM

@Howard-Vigorita, WOW! You tested all of that yourself?

Newbie😁

Vegas Pro 22 (VP18-21 also installed)

Win 11 Pro always updated

AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16 cores / 32 threads

32GB DDR4 3200

Sapphire RX6700XT 12GB Driver: 25.3.1

Gigabyte X570 Elite Motherboard

Panasonic G9, G7, FZ300

Howard-Vigorita wrote on 8/10/2021, 2:06 PM

I did. Over the course of several weeks. One interesting thing I noticed was that if I used the same version of Vegas, I got identical qsv quality results from my laptop and 9900k machines which have radically different cpu packages containing the uhd630. Same with a Nuc whose low-power, 4-core cpu contains a slightly different hd630 along with an amd Vega/m.

Reyfox wrote on 8/10/2021, 3:06 PM

@Howard-Vigorita an amazing amount of work for one person!

Newbie😁

Vegas Pro 22 (VP18-21 also installed)

Win 11 Pro always updated

AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16 cores / 32 threads

32GB DDR4 3200

Sapphire RX6700XT 12GB Driver: 25.3.1

Gigabyte X570 Elite Motherboard

Panasonic G9, G7, FZ300

Former user wrote on 8/12/2021, 3:50 PM

Intel: Decode with Hardware. Encode with Software unless you have an Xe/Xe Max system.

QSV has remained largely unchanged for several generations. I think the newer Xe/Xe Max systems is the first time this has been upgraded in any decent way in several generations, so you're not going to get better H.264 out of a 9th Gen System when compared to a 7th Gen system, etc.

Nvidia: Decode and Encode with Hardware.

AMD: Decode with Hardware. Encode HEVC with Hardware, H.264 with Software.