Feature request: Standardized 4k test project.

Comments

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 3:18 AM

@JN_ - As to GPU Drivers, the Builder at distance, deleted and reinstalled TWICE the new drivers.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

JN_ wrote on 7/11/2019, 3:39 AM

Theres a utility, I think it's called DDU, not at my PC now. Its available say on Guru3D site etc. It completely removes all older drivers before reinstalling new ones, maybe they did that.

Anyway, let's know how you get on later with 2 new 4K tests and my link today for 2K Red Car.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/11/2019, 3:40 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 4:40 AM

Theres a utility, It completely removes all older drivers before reinstalling new ones, maybe they did that.

@JN_ - It wasn’t an old one at all. It was the existing present driver. The Builder noted the then existing Driver and even so deleted it ALL and reinstalled afresh.

Anyway, let's know how you get on later with 2 new 4K tests and my link today for 2K Red Car.

@JN_ - Honestly? I’m scared to run it.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 5:12 AM

Again, Region 5 makes VP FallOver.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

JN_ wrote on 7/11/2019, 5:44 AM

@Grazie I know you did this already and got “choppy” playback. Disable HW Acc. i.e. options/preferences/video ...

Now after reloading VP observe the “choppy” playback rate across ALL regions.

My playback rate on a modern laptop varies per region, but the lowest by far is region 5..

I'll update this shortly with the lowest fps per region.

You could have a faulty graphics card.

Playback on laptop with HW Acc off ... THESE ARE ALL MINIMUM VALUES OBSERVED PER REGION.

R1 ... 7.7

R2 ... 10.?

R3 ... 17.?

R4 ... 4.?

R5 ... 1.8

R6 ... 21.?

R7 ... 6.?

So R5 does stress playback rate higher on my laptop than any other region.

 

Now the point of this exercise is this ... I get full playback rate 99% of the time when I enable HW Acc.

So if you can get the same or better playback, than my values, with CPU playback only, no HW Acc. (and you cannot get full playback on R5 with HW Acc enabled) then its a graphics issue, you first need to swap out the card and test a different one, since you’ve already done a lot of other things, in the SW area.

Of course if you get less than my multi region testing above without HW Acc. then look for your money back😂

 All of my playback tests are done at best/full. Also and very important, make sure that “adjust size and quality for optimal playback is unchecked” i.e. right click the preview window to change it. If this is left checked then you’ll get unrealistically high values.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/11/2019, 6:46 AM, changed a total of 10 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 5:53 AM

@JN_ Ahah! It's that Region 5 not conforming to Project Frame Rate, you can see the Squiggly Lines:

Fine. So there's a lowered Frame Rate, 0.632, to go slomo, I can dig that.

And this is the Region that kludges......

So now I test running a conformed version of the same Event to Frame Rate "1.000" and it plays ALL beautifully.

Ah, but wait . . . I see the NEXT Event, Region 6 is also 0.632, but that has NO issues.

I have no idea why there should be issues, really I don't. One Event kludges with 0.632 but the immeadiately following Event at 0.632 does not kludge? Any suggestions on why?

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

JN_ wrote on 7/11/2019, 5:59 AM

@Grazie Just see how your playback rate per region is compared to my tests above. Tip .. use a selection of each region and observe, press Q to toggle looping on or off, because of caching it might be a little artificial but its an easy way to test.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

JN_ wrote on 7/11/2019, 6:36 AM

@Grazie All of my playback tests are done at best/full. Also and very important, make sure that “adjust size and quality for optimal playback is unchecked” i.e. right click the preview window to change it. If this is left checked then you’ll get an unrealistically high value.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/11/2019, 6:43 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 7:35 AM

@JN_ - Thank you. I think we’re getting somewhere. Just spent an hour with the Builder Technician and I showed him the kludging-issue. He agreed I should be getting better. O...K... wanting to show him the Task Manager GPU usage at the same time as getting the Kludge, I made the VP Workspace about a sixth of Screen area. Guess what? No kludging. O...k... So, it would appear that the output to my screen is demanding a better throughput, to deal with that Region5. And that’s all.

Two things are going to happen:

1) The Video team are going to have a chat, to see what can be tweaked.

2) Going to run a GPU test to, again, confirm the Nvidia is up to muster.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 2:35 PM

Well the Test give a Check Mark to my nVidia Card. So that's not the issue.

@JN_ - Yup, done all the Region Preview Tests. All set to BEST Full. It's only Region 5 that gives me a WHITW out.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

JN_ wrote on 7/11/2019, 2:53 PM

@Grazie

Ok. What were your 7 individual region MINIMUM playback times with HW Acc set to off?

With “adjust size and quality for optimal playback” set to off.

See my post today at 11:44.

I appreciate that region 5 Kludges, but maybe some actual figures would be a bit more enlightening.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/11/2019, 3:21 PM, changed a total of 5 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 3:16 PM

@JN_ - What will this prove?

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

JN_ wrote on 7/11/2019, 3:30 PM

I'm really at a loss what to say to that.

Its not to PROVE anything, although in my first request for this information I did elucidate the point of it, its part of a methology of fault finding that I, and I'm sure others would use. i.e. when presented with a problem, request some hard data, attempt to close in on the possible cause by data collection and eleminiation of as many variables as possible.

If the user doesn’t or can't be bothered to supply same, it’s really difficult to help.

You may notice that its quite common for users, when they come here looking for help to be first asked to give certain details, using mediainfo for software analysis, then PC specs for HW analysis .. etc etc.

The data points that I requested, twice now, are surely significant insofar as its a playback issue.

Will they help to resolve the issue? who knows. But for example, issues that you have may appear in another users machine in the future, and the more data you supply might help them, and you perhaps to finally resolve or at least explain the issue.

For my part I cannot understand your reluctance to supply the requested data. If I and others are willing to give our time to your issue then you should be delighted to cooperate in any attempts to resolve it.

I would understand your reluctance to supply say daft requests, say the colour of your shirt, it would be unlikely to assist in resolving the issue.

If you do consider my request daft or unnecessary then thats fine.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/11/2019, 3:49 PM, changed a total of 8 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 4:00 PM

@JN_ - Thanks for assisting. Suffice it to say that all the Regions play well except Region 5. I’m not reluctant, far from it, I just want to know what will this indicate. It was a simple request from me.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

JN_ wrote on 7/11/2019, 4:25 PM

@JN_ - Thanks for assisting. Suffice it to say that all the Regions play well except Region 5. I’m not reluctant, far from it, I just want to know what will this indicate. It was a simple request from me.

@Grazie I already, at length elucidated the “point” in my 11:44AM request, and I elaborated in a more general way the benefits of hard data in my last post.

I'm pretty sure I understand, from your previous, many posts, ... you strike me as a very creative person, so for you terms like Kludging and the regions play well mean more to you than actual figures, and or is sufficient for you. Over and out.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 4:31 PM

@JN_ - I can do evidenced based results, but it’ll be tomorrow now. Again, thanks for assisting.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

BruceUSA wrote on 7/11/2019, 5:31 PM

GRAZIE. What is going on with your new MONSTA? I heard you said he is the speed demon . Region 5 choking him down?. All kidding aside. Really there is nothing special about region 5, other then it is slowing down. Something else causing your system to do that. My beast only getting a blink in region 5.

Grazie wrote on 7/11/2019, 5:53 PM

GRAZIE. What is going on with your new MONSTA? I heard you said he is the speed demon .

@BruceUSA - I have no idea?

Region 5 choking him down?.

@BruceUSA - Yes.

All kidding aside. Really there is nothing special about region 5, other then it is slowing down.

@BruceUSA - I know, it’s really odd.

Something else causing your system to do that. My beast only getting a blink in region 5.

@BruceUSA - What’s a “blink”? Weird thing is, is that the NEXT Region, Region 6, plays fine. I’ve spent much of today on this. I’ve had the Builders interrogate my machine and checking out the nVidia GPU with a stress test. The Card came through with an AOK Health Check. @JN_ has tried to assist me as well.

Anyway MochaPro19, TWIXTOR, NeatVideo5 and Magic Bullet Looks are running very fast.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

BruceUSA wrote on 7/11/2019, 6:10 PM

Running at realtime when it hit region 5, all I see is the framerate blink a split second and back up to real time again.

Perhaps you got a corrupted media in region 5?. That seem to be your only complaint.

Grazie wrote on 7/12/2019, 12:24 AM

@JN_ Hi there. I just completed your comparisons Testing scenarios:

HARDWARE ACCEL OFF

R1 ... 7.7 G 9? > FULL

    R2 ... 10.? G 26?> FULL

    R3 ... 17.? G 26 > FULL

    R4 ... 4.? G 10? > FULL

    R5 ... 1.8 G 7.3 > NEVER FULL

    R6 ... 21.? G 28? > FULL

    R7 ... 6.? G 9.7 > NEVER FULL

"G"=Grazie

">" = Goes almost immeadiately to FULL or NEVER FULL

HARDWARE ACCEL BACK ON

All regions except R5 almost immediately, maybe 3 frames, get to100%.

I still can't get R5 to play thru' with HW ACCL on. I get about 40% in and VP Preview freezes and I'm left with the Audio playing:

Having followed your process and your analysis, this should be pointing to a GPU issue. But in contradiction yesterday the Build Engineer ran the GPU Stress Test s/w 3DMark-v2-9-6631 and that gave the GPU a clean bill of health.

Grazie

PC 7 64-bit 16gb * Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz * 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 560 Ti

PC 10 64-bit 64gb * Intel® Core™i9 - 3.3GHz * 40Gb NVIDIA  GeForce RTX 2070

Cameras: Canon XF300 + PowerShot SX60HS Bridge

JN_ wrote on 7/12/2019, 1:10 AM

@Grazie

”I still can't get R5 to play thru' with HW ACCL on. I get about 40% in and VP Preview freezes and I'm left with the Audio playing:”

What's the playback rate for the 40%, is it about full less 3 frames?

If it is then you have no issue at all except a freeze issue.

 

The freezing problem is very likely an Nvidia driver issue combined with the latest W10 1903 update. Have you tried selecting Intel as HW Acc instead of Nvidia.

Looking at your specs, core i9, without which model type, I cannot make out whether its with or without iGPU support, insufficient data in your profile, Skylake or Coffee Lake, Coffee Lake has iGpu, Skylake doesn’t.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/12/2019, 3:03 AM, changed a total of 6 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

JN_ wrote on 7/12/2019, 1:31 AM

The reason I speculate above is because I experience the exact same freeze, in the Red Car test around the time since I’ve upgraded to Windows update 1903. I have to kill VP each time with Task Manager.

The freeze occurs when I press playback, play for a good while then pause, then freezes.

I decided to try to fix it yesterday evening. On my laptop which only exposes the Gtx 1070, (Intel is onboard the cpu but not available) it went away by changing from the latest Nvidia creators driver to the latest Gaming driver.

This driver change didn’t work on my new and old PC's. To fix it on them I simply switched HW Acc. to Intel.

The freeze doesn’t appear on playback of other media I tested so far, only the Red Car test.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/12/2019, 1:43 AM, changed a total of 2 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

JN_ wrote on 7/12/2019, 1:50 AM

@Grazie As for your individual playback times compared to my laptop used, I'd say there isnt an issue when HW Acc. is off. The R5 difference is roughly what I would expect you to get, when looking at the other Region times differences between our two machines.

Other users may post better playback results, for a machine thats similar or lesser specced to yours, but it’s possible that they just might be overlooking this ... “adjust size and quality for optimal playback” set to off. If its checked then you’ll mostly get full playback.

Setting to Best/full playback is essential also.

 

Last changed by JN_ on 7/12/2019, 2:34 AM, changed a total of 4 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.

JN_ wrote on 7/12/2019, 1:56 AM

@Grazie You see heres the thing ... With your HW Acc on ...

“I still can't get R5 to play thru' with HW ACCL on. I get about 40% in and VP Preview freezes and I'm left with the Audio playing:”

I understood from your posts yesterday etc that you were playing through R5, just not very well. Now we’re dealing with a new reality, the issue is not one of playback through R5 but of freezing, which i’ve attempted to address above.

I've known about this freeze issue for a while, I had no real reason to address it, since on my laptop I could get playback through R5, it only freezes when I stop playback. I assume your 7.3 value is got just before it freezes.

If I had known much earlier that Grazie speak for freeze = Kludges then this could have been addressed much earlier.

Last changed by JN_ on 7/12/2019, 2:28 AM, changed a total of 4 times.

 

Desktop and Laptop basic specs ...

Both run Win 10, has latest updates ...

Running latest ver. of Vegas Pro with latest updates.

VP13 B453 also.

Vegaseur and Pluraleyes installed on both ...

Quicktime 7.79.80.95

PC ...

i9 9900K, Intel Graphics 630. Nov 2018.

Mem. 32gb DDR4

Graphics card .. Nvidia Rtx 2080 Ti

Nvidia Graphics driver .. latest Studio driver.

Latest Intel Graphics driver

 

Laptop ... (Acer Predator G9-793-77AC)

CPU .. i7-6700HQ Skylake-H

Memory ..16GB DDR4 

Graphics card .. Nvidia GTX 1070, latest Studio driver.