Comments

Vdanny wrote on 9/9/2021, 12:57 PM

Hi @David-Priz,

Enabling the iGPU should allow you access to Intel QSV hardware accelerated rendering capability which are speedy and of good quality. The GTX 1070 would continue to be used for the heavy lifting for timeline playback performance and effects.

RogerS wrote on 9/9/2021, 9:21 PM

QSV decoding is also very strong in Vegas with support for more file types. I'd use it in file i/o decoding as well (should be the default if enabled).

eikira wrote on 9/10/2021, 3:30 PM

I have Vegas Pro 18 and a I9 10850 with a GTX 1070 GPU. My question is should I enable the 10850 IGPU also? What are the advantages vs disadvantages? Thanks


For the time being i had to switch from my very powerfull 16 core AMD to an intel 11900k 8 Core. And the only reason is its iGPU decoding support in Vegas. So that tells everything i think. If intel launches soon, maybe, dedicated Xe GPUs i may switch back to my AMD.

Reyfox wrote on 9/13/2021, 6:26 AM

I've been reading and following this "iGPU" topic along with others. As my sig says, I'm using an all AMD computer. What are the "real world" advantages of the iGPU? What does it offer that I can't already experience?

With the proliferation of AMD CPU's in computing, should not VEGAS not ignore their capabilities?

RogerS wrote on 9/13/2021, 7:36 AM

If you've been following the threads you know that the Intel hardware decoder is highly compatible and there are some formats that only work with this in Vegas. Other formats like HEVC 10-bit 4:2:2 only have hardware decoding with the latest Intel processors and iGPUs.

Here's a chart referencing Resolve that shows clearly which GPUs support what: https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/What-H-264-H-265-Hardware-Decoding-is-Supported-in-DaVinci-Resolve-Studio-2122/

Also, of the big 3 AMD appears to be the weakest with driver support. I can't count how many people with Radeon graphics (mobile) I had to prompt to update drivers as it caused corrupt images with Vegas due to driver bugs that they shipped with.

Reyfox wrote on 9/13/2021, 8:20 AM

@RogerS thanks for the information. When time permits, I'll download that Resolve Studio test, to test on my computer. Also I am waiting to see what intel brings in the Adler CPU's. As for AMD driver support, others with other video cards have experienced issues to the point where VEGAS now has it to update the drivers. It was like all the comments with Nvidia pointing to Studio drivers and not the "gaming" drivers.

RogerS wrote on 9/13/2021, 7:52 PM

I'm also starting to think about a next system (had it with laptop thermal throttling) and interested in next gen Intel. I wish Vegas would prompt/nag to update drivers upon install. That would save a lot of grief.

I was part of the unhappy NVIDIA crowd for a while with VP 18 until the release of the Studio driver and putting file i/o back to defaults (NVDEC wasn't working well for me then).

xberk wrote on 9/13/2021, 8:00 PM

I'm 99% now on the i9-11900 with RTX3080 .. I think the iGPU has my attention as the way to go .

Paul B .. PCI Express Video Card: EVGA VCX 10G-P5-3885-KL GeForce RTX 3080 XC3 ULTRA ,,  Intel Core i9-11900K Desktop Processor ,,  MSI Z590-A PRO Desktop Motherboard LGA-1200 ,, 64GB (2X32GB) XPG GAMMIX D45 DDR4 3200MHz 288-Pin SDRAM PC4-25600 Memory .. Seasonic Power Supply SSR-1000FX Focus Plus 1000W ,, Arctic Liquid Freezer II – 360MM .. Fractal Design case ,, Samsung Solid State Drive MZ-V8P1T0B/AM 980 PRO 1TB PCI Express 4 NVMe M.2 ,, Wundiws 10 .. Vegas Pro 19 Edit

Howard-Vigorita wrote on 9/15/2021, 12:51 AM

... What are the "real world" advantages of the iGPU? What does it offer that I can't already experience?

@Reyfox Having a 2nd gpu allows the workload to be split across 2 independent graphics processors. An igpu tightly bound with the cpu has the advantage of being able to communicate with it without traversing the pcie bus. Offset by the disadvantage of both of them sharing their heat.

Another way to go is to just add a 2nd gpu devoted to decoding. I have a Xeon machine with no igpu and that's exactly what I did. Like @eikira I was expecting an Intel pcie board to be released. But got tired of waiting so I picked up an Nvidia 1660 cheap and added it to the amd video board already present. The only silver lining is that was before gpu prices went crazy. My only regret is not buying 2 of them at the time. If I had a Ryzen with a high end Nvidia board, I'd be looking for a medium performance Amd board like an rx580 or 590... mixing it up has the advantage of more easily being able to tell them apart on the Video and I/O screens. I was worried that 2 boards from the same manufacturer might confuse the drivers and/or Vegas.

todd-b wrote on 9/15/2021, 2:02 AM

... What are the "real world" advantages of the iGPU? What does it offer that I can't already experience?

@Reyfox Having a 2nd gpu allows the workload to be split across 2 independent graphics processors. An igpu tightly bound with the cpu has the advantage of being able to communicate with it without traversing the pcie bus. Offset by the disadvantage of both of them sharing their heat.

When you say advantage is that something that's been proven or something that sounds like it should yield a benefit but it's unproven? The disadvantage can be proven, as the 15-20? watts of the IGPU will contribute to the heat of the CPU which might be enough to cause thermal throttling

Something that I know causes a slow down in GPU processing is Nvenc hardware encoding on the same card, it doesn't seem to make sense as the amount of gpu processing the NVENC needs when added to the GPU processing by the other software may not be anywhere near 100% but processing will be slower compared to running software without an Nvenc encoding session. The interesting thing is that not using the Nvenc on your main GPU and instead using NVENC on a 2nd card like a 1660 still causes the same slow down, even though you would expect a difference. Requires further investigation

Reyfox wrote on 9/15/2021, 4:28 AM

Thanks @Howard-Vigorita and @todd-b. I could possibly understand that if "time in money" getting another GPU, whether integrated or not, but how much of an actual performance gain is it (say using Intel with iGPU and a graphics card).

I understand bottlenecks and communication over the PC motherboard, but is it that much of a difference?

RogerS wrote on 9/15/2021, 4:44 AM

If we're talking desktop builds it shouldn't be such an issue to mitigate the increased temp of an iGPU and avoid thermal throttling through intelligent case design and well-placed active cooling systems. If enthusiasts can heavily overclock systems it should be possible to mitigate heat from ordinary clock speeds while using the iGPU.

For laptops I've only got a sample of 1 here to test and it hits throttling quickly with the iGPU engaged. It also hits it with using the other GPU, so I'm coming to the conclusion that thin and light laptops are ill-suited for sustained CPU + GPU performance and therefore aren't a good idea for video editing, even if they have adequate CPU and GPU specs on paper. Seeing reports of mobile 30XX series cards getting outperformed by 1650s when the latter can sustain its power for longer.

AVsupport wrote on 9/16/2021, 7:29 AM

In previous builds of VP (I don't have 19), I was able to mitigate stability issues by disabling IGPU all together. These days, the development focus seems to have been more iGPU centric, thus no timeline decode acceleration for nVidia using HEVC source for example. Your best chance now is Intel QSV. Personally I'm not interested in that method since a dedicated powerful graphics card is always going to outperform an iGPU. But only if the software supports it. Currently, I see better performance with my system using Resolve as it will use nVidia. As much as I love the VP interface, I currently can't really use it, unfortunately, for most things HEVC.

my current Win10/64 system (latest drivers, water cooled) :

Intel Coffee Lake i5 Hexacore (unlocked, but not overclocked) 4.0 GHz on Z370 chipset board,

32GB (4x8GB Corsair Dual Channel DDR4-2133) XMP-3000 RAM,

Intel 600series 512GB M.2 SSD system drive running Win10/64 home automatic driver updates,

Crucial BX500 1TB EDIT 3D NAND SATA 2.5-inch SSD

2x 4TB 7200RPM NAS HGST data drive,

Intel HD630 iGPU - currently disabled in Bios,

nVidia GTX1060 6GB, always on latest [creator] drivers. nVidia HW acceleration enabled.

main screen 4K/50p 1ms scaled @175%, second screen 1920x1080/50p 1ms.

RogerS wrote on 9/16/2021, 7:37 AM

a dedicated powerful graphics card is always going to outperform an iGPU

Except when it doesn't. (encode and decode).

If Vegas also leveraged the rest of dedicated card's computational capabilities in addition to those two functions Vegas would be on par with Resolve et al. But it doesn't (yet).

todd-b wrote on 9/16/2021, 8:10 AM

In previous builds of VP (I don't have 19), I was able to mitigate stability issues by disabling IGPU all together. These days, the development focus seems to have been more iGPU centric, thus no timeline decode acceleration for nVidia using HEVC source for example. Your best chance now is Intel QSV.

The annoying thing is that based on how quickly 422 decode was implemented in Vegas , I think almost simultaneously with the release of the new CPU's , vegas supported 422 via Intel IGPU. It's like they're using a plugin/toolkit/framework (whatever is the correct terminology) that just works once the new GPU drivers are released, but with Nvidia and AMD it's not the case yet it could be, they have to code everything specifically for vegas but they don't bother

 

Howard-Vigorita wrote on 9/16/2021, 11:30 AM

a dedicated powerful graphics card is always going to outperform an iGPU

Except when it doesn't. (encode and decode).

Pcie graphics will outperform an igpu whenever it's doing something that requires a bigger processor with more on-board resources. Like for stream mixing and fx. But if it can be accomplished in on-board asics, encoding and decoding wouldn't use those resources and the asics don't seem to be that heat intensive. With the inherent communication speed advantage, an igpu would be a better performance choice for encoding and decoding when available. Keeping in mind that not all formats can be processed in asic.

None of the igpus in my systems do very well as the general gpu in Vegas. The notable exception is the VegaM in the Intel 8809g. But I wouldn't recommend running out and buying one... both Intel and Amd have kind of disowned support for it. But I think its igpu is similar to that in the Ryzen g-series. I imagine teaming a 5700g up with a high-end Nvidia board might do quite well in Vegas.