Play back lagging at 422 10bit

Rocky-Say wrote on 2/18/2022, 8:37 PM

Adobe pro finally kill all those footage….it Vegas pro issues and Vegas do a lot of lagging and playtime ..thanks for everyone now I switch to premiere pro

Former user wrote on 2/19/2022, 12:02 AM

You never bothered uploading a small sample file to a file host as requested, you'll never know if it was just you that couldn't play back the file.

Hilly wrote on 10/16/2022, 3:02 AM

I got a Sony A7SIII nearly 12 months ago and when I got it I tried to stretch its legs and went and filmed a band one night...I Filmed it all in 10bit 4k, mostly using Slog 3, some in S Cinetone. I even shot a portion of it at 100fps to get some good slow mo. I have found that I am not having problems with playback in "normal" frame rates and have not had to use proxies yet but the 100fps stutters from time to time. When I load that 100fps into Premiere it plays completely smoothly, but I would prefer to work in Vegas for most of my editing.

I have tried disabling GPU assistance etc but this doesn't seem to make a whole lot of difference.

I don't know if this will be the same for everyone with the problems with just the higher frame rates as I have a pretty beefy setup.

Ryzen 5950X 16 core

GTX 3080 10 gig GPU

64 gig RAM

Samsung Pro 2Tb SSD

xberk wrote on 4/13/2023, 8:55 PM

@Hilly .. this is good to hear that footage from the A7SIII previews smoothly in Vegas on your Ryzen system. Is that still the case?

I'm interested in getting an A7iv and had concerns as I'd prefer not to have to use proxies.

RogerS wrote on 4/13/2023, 11:10 PM

For decoding the CPU isn't so important it's the GPU.

a7SIII footage mostly plays back very well with Intel GPUs/iGPUs- except for HEVC 4:2:2 I don't see any need for proxies with my desktop (see signature). There's plenty of sample media you can try with your 11th gen Intel.

xberk wrote on 4/13/2023, 11:48 PM

For decoding the CPU isn't so important it's the GPU.

a7SIII footage mostly plays back very well with Intel GPUs/iGPUs- except for HEVC 4:2:2 I don't see any need for proxies with my desktop (see signature). There's plenty of sample media you can try with your 11th gen Intel.

@RogerS .. Thanks Roger. This encourages me to take the plunge on the A7iv .. I principally make short films, doing little with stills .. so it might even be the FX3 .. but likely the A7iv to start my journey into full frame camera-land.

RogerS wrote on 4/14/2023, 12:06 AM

Both should be great cameras- I've been shooting side by side with a filmmaker who "downgraded" from a larger cinema cam and got a FX3 recently. A7iv would be good if you also do photography.

There are a lot of choices for file formats from these newer Sonys so I'd do some workflow testing with your system and VEGAS and find a combination that works smoothly for you.

Wolfgang S. wrote on 4/14/2023, 12:35 AM

There are a lot of choices for file formats from these newer Sonys so I'd do some workflow testing with your system and VEGAS and find a combination that works smoothly for you.

That is very true. I have seen that also with my FS7 long time ago, that - for example - slog3 UHD 50p 10bit XAVC-i log footage plays back hard in Vegas, especially since I had to enable the ACES transformation to HDR10. While long-GOP 10bit footage plays back much better. Those findings are similar for both of my systems (see my signiture for the system specs).

xberk wrote on 4/14/2023, 11:21 AM

Both should be great cameras- I've been shooting side by side with a filmmaker who "downgraded" from a larger cinema cam and got a FX3 recently. A7iv would be good if you also do photography.

There are a lot of choices for file formats from these newer Sonys so I'd do some workflow testing with your system and VEGAS and find a combination that works smoothly for you.

@RogerS Where can I find some 4K 10 bit footage to test on my system?

RogerS wrote on 4/14/2023, 9:47 PM

I just did a search for FX6, FX3 and a7sIII footage and amassed a collection of different variants.

One place: https://filmplusgear.com/sony-fx6-test-files-for-download/

Another (see description):

xberk wrote on 4/15/2023, 12:36 AM

I just did a search for FX6, FX3 and a7sIII footage and amassed a collection of different variants.

One place: https://filmplusgear.com/sony-fx6-test-files-for-download/

Another (see description):

@RogerS .. Huge thanks Roger .. I downloaded the the first 10 bit 4:2:2 Slog-3 (MXF files) .. plays great on my system at Best Auto preview (almost full frame rate) .. I slapped a quick Slog-3 LUT onto it and it graded fairly nice in a flash with no extra effort. Nice. Very encouraging .. If I had to decide right now it would be the A7iv ... I'm starting to think the investment in the glass is going to be the big deal.

Howard-Vigorita wrote on 4/15/2023, 11:04 AM

Tried the 1st one myself on my laptop w/12900h & 3060 vp20. 422 avc 10-bit 50fps mxf intra and best fps I could get w/Vegas slog3-709 built-in lut was about 8. w/o lut around 24. Ooops... just realized it's on battery.

What a difference plugged in: 35-45 fps w/lut at good-auto and 50fps w/o lut. w/Sony 4_SGamut3CineSLog3_To_Cine+709 looks much better but plays a little slower: 25-35 fps.

Also tried Aces and playback performance was about the same 25-35 fps. Looked better than the Vegas built-in lut but to my eye I liked the Sony 3D one at 32-bit full a little better.

xberk wrote on 4/15/2023, 11:45 AM

Some of the files are MOV prores .. can't open those in VP19. Is that right? No support for Prores ?

Howard-Vigorita wrote on 4/15/2023, 12:13 PM

I believe vp19 build 458 was the last to contain beta prores raw support before apple made them remove it.

RogerS wrote on 4/15/2023, 8:41 PM

ProRes raw does not work, ProRes does.

fr0sty wrote on 4/15/2023, 9:35 PM

Yes, regular ProRes works fantastic in VEGAS, to the point that I'd say using it for 10+ bit shooting is preferable to upgrading your hardware (assuming you already have a decently-modern system) when it comes to getting more performance out of VEGAS.

xberk wrote on 4/15/2023, 11:12 PM

ProRes raw does not work, ProRes does.

Yes, regular ProRes works fantastic in VEGAS, to the point that I'd say using it for 10+ bit shooting is preferable to upgrading your hardware (assuming you already have a decently-modern system) when it comes to getting more performance out of VEGAS.

@RogerS .. @fr0sty .. Thanks guys. I found a 10 bit ProRes sample and YES, it plays smoothly .. rock solid full frame rate on Best/Auto .. Thanks for clearing that up guys!

Kyle-Ansell wrote on 7/12/2023, 6:36 PM

New purchase FX30. I'm transitioning from 8bit to 10bit and want to lean on you guys for some help if possible.

Just read through everyone's comments as I'm having a little playback lag with some footage taken. Its not terrible, but I'm afraid to film a full shoot and potentially struggle with the edit. Time is key for me so any support to ensure I'm set before I make the full leap would be ideal. I'm not keen on editing with DR or PP so will hopefully be able to stick with Vegas Pro.

If anyone shoots with similar settings in there latest Sony cameras and can suggest any settings for both camera and Vegas to be able to film 10bit 4k , that would be very helpful.

Up until now I have been limited to shooting 8bit 4k 25fps, and 8bit 1080p 50fps using the A73 and A6600. For my next gig at the weekend, I'm gona have to use the FX30 in 8bit as this will match my other cameras, however I really want to get away from 8bit and picture profiles and start shooting proper log footage. Next level for me.

Figured I would post this here as others with a similar question may find there way here.

My system is;

Ryzen 9 5900x (12core)
RTX 3070
64GB Ram
Footage on sabrent rocket 4.0 1tb
Latest Vegas Update

Footage is;

General
Complete name : C:\Users\K Productions\Desktop\PRIVATE\M4ROOT\CLIP\C0005.MP4
Format : XAVC
Codec ID : XAVC (XAVC/mp42/iso6)
File size : 961 MiB
Duration : 37 s 440 ms
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 215 Mb/s
Frame rate : 50.000 FPS
Encoded date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC
Tagged date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High 4:2:2@L5.2
Format settings : CABAC / 2 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, Reference frames : 2 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 37 s 440 ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 200 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 50.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Bit depth : 10 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.482
Stream size : 894 MiB (93%)
Encoded date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC
Tagged date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC
Color range : Full
Metas : 3
Codec configuration box : avcC

Audio
ID : 2
Format : PCM
Format settings : Big / Signed
Codec ID : twos
Duration : 37 s 440 ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 6.86 MiB (1%)
Encoded date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC
Tagged date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC

Other
ID : 3
Type : meta
Format : rtmd
Codec ID : rtmd
Duration : 37 s 440 ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Encoded date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC
Tagged date : 2023-07-12 19:14:46 UTC

Former user wrote on 7/12/2023, 7:49 PM

Maybe replace your original camera files with the sony generated proxies, edit with the sony proxies, then replace the proxies with the full quality camera files. I have heard of people using camera proxies in place of the terrible quality proxies Vegas generates, but think there are problems with that, Vegas will not show the full quality of your camera proxies.

I don't know how difficult that workflow would be though if you're using many multiple camera files. I bet there's someone with experience that can help.

RogerS wrote on 7/12/2023, 8:25 PM

What camera settings will yield media that will work well with your system is something you just need to test. My own tests are with an Intel iGPU so won't translate as your decoding is with an NVIDIA GPU.

fr0sty wrote on 7/12/2023, 8:40 PM

Just use proxies, they work great, and you can easily switch between proxies and original media by changing the preview quality from preview to good or best.

Wolfgang S. wrote on 7/13/2023, 1:49 AM

You could also set the project settings to UHD 25p for editing, and/or reduce the preview quality. And change it back to 50p for rendering.

Even for AVC it will be hard to achieve 50p with UHD in Vegas.

Please post the project settings in detail - will you edit in 8bit or 32bit?