'More crying, are you feeling rejection, can't force everyone to follow your "beliefs"?"
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Judging by the tone of your writing... I am not the one feeling rejected. :)

"No, not for argument. It was the resolution to an argument. "
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yyyyyyeah... okay. You just keep saying that.... sooner or later you will actually believe your own words.

Did you get the count on that so far Spot??

YUP... that's right.... and I can STILL burn a reliable HD DVD that will playback in ANY machine.
Again, that's irrelevant. The issue is that you complained about the BR burners. You were down on Sony for "not having their act together" and yet you conveniently forget that Toshiba doesn't have its act together any more. When the HD burners are readily available and can easily burn full-featured discs that are playable on any HD-DVD player or drive, THEN you can say they're better than BR.

At the moment (because I don't think the HD drives are in stores yet), I could (if I had a BR burner) burn my movie to high definition disc. My movie is over 90 minutes. You can't do that with HD yet, can you? Yes, when the burners arrive you might be able to, but right now you can't. So who's better? HD because you can burn 20 minutes or so onto a regular disc, or BR where you can burn your entire movie plus more? Maybe it's a toss-up, but if that's the case, you can still give it a rest about how much better HD-DVD is for burning.

Gee, winrock, I was just planning a post about polar bears being subjected to excessive heat being generated by the HD DVD crowd with BLink3times being the mastermind of the secret plan to melt the ice caps to floor Sony's Japan BD facilities------- that fairly similar to a HD DVD post about Sony . ;-) Its just humor of course, Blink3times is not planning anything like that or is he.................;-) that blinking part of the name--------- ;-)

"Again, that's irrelevant. The issue is that you complained about the BR burners. You were down on Sony for "not having their act together" and yet you conveniently forget that Toshiba doesn't have its act together any more. When the HD burners are readily available and can easily burn full-featured discs that are playable on any HD-DVD player or drive, THEN you can say they're better than BR."
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What the heck good is a burner if you can't reliably use it??? BD has had a burner out for how long now??? They don't even have any reasonable software included.

With HD DVD you don't NEED a burner... it sure would be nice... but it's not NEEDED.

Well, Fred, since you're so darn smart and the rest of us are so darn stupid, why don't explain it us and tell us exactly how these things work.

Jay, I just did.

With HD DVD you don't NEED a burner... it sure would be nice... but it's not NEEDED.

Blink, you're comparing BR's ability to burn a real BR disc with HD's ability to burn a regular DVD? And you consider that an apt and fair comparison? How about comparing apples to apples? BR drives can burn BR discs. And they've been able to do that for a while. Where are the HD discs? YES, I'M FREAKIN' AWARE THAT YOU CAN BURN HD CONTENT ON A FREAKING REGULAR DVD BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT AND IT'S NOT WHAT YOUR COMPLAINT REGARDING BR IS ABOUT.

Now, please compare burning a real BR disc to burning a REAL HD-DVD disc.

And by the way, can't you burn AVCHD discs on regular discs for BR? So doesn't that put BR on par with HD? Actually, doesn't that put BR ahead, since it can burn on regular discs (assuming I've heard right) as well as on real BR discs? Perfect? No, I guess not. But neither is HD, so why single out BR as being terrible?

@blink,

And yes.... from a burning aspect ... BD is "crappy" . Sorry guy... I really truly wish I could say something other than that.... but I can't
===================================================

blink,

you don't have a f***g clue what you are talking about.

I have LiteOn BD burner and only use BD-RE and they are burned perfectly with Nero and ImgBurn at constant 2x.

I can author BDMV on BD-R/RE with TSRemax for free and PS3 plays it perfectly.

Sony S1 and S300 BD players play BDMV after firmware update.

Do you have HD DVD burner so you can compare it to BD burner?

Please, stop spreading this HD DVD bull shit.

Just give it up and move to AVS forum.

Geeh whiz, give me a break. These hardly stand out as savvy business practices...

How about asking them to surrender?
Why ask someone to surrender if you're winning?

How about asking them to join in order to make something bigger and better?
Yeah, right. You actually believe that?

How about asking them to join merely as a publicity ruse?
To what end? What's the purpose? What would such a "ruse" get them, especially when the public discovers it's bogus?

How about asking them to join so it puts them on the defensive?
Gee, I thought they already were... HD DVD vs. Blue Ray?

Sorry, Fred, your business acumen is no better than mine, certainly nothing to write home about.

Up to now, I had been taking your input rather seriously.

"And by the way, can't you burn AVCHD discs on regular discs for BR? So doesn't that put BR on par with HD? Actually, doesn't that put BR ahead, since it can burn on regular discs (assuming I've heard right) as well as on real BR discs? Perfect? No, I guess not. But neither is HD, so why single out BR as being terrible?"
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Yes... well I was going to point out that your size reference to 3xdvd is a bit wrong... but then I decided not to. But since you bring it up...

Double layer 3xdvd can hold up to 40 minutes of mpeg (in a full authored disk with dd5.1, I know because I have done about 100 of them so far)

But unlike the more expensive BD players that for the most part DO NOT support avchd playback (or at least there is no set standard)... ALL tosh players do... it's part of the spec. The new BDp500 is supposed to playback AVCHD... but then it will cost you a cool $700 (BD still doesn't get it with the pricing).

i don't have a lot of experience with AVCHD but my GUESS is that you can get about 70 or 80 minutes (somebody correct me if I am wrong on the time) on a DL dvd

Given these choices, and the fact that Tosh has a set standard so I KNOW the disk I create will playback in ANY machine... I'll GLADLY stay on THIS side of the fence thank you very much.

"Sony S1 and S300 BD players play BDMV after firmware update."
=================================================
Well, if you were at all clued in and reading properly you would have discovered waaaay above that the boys in the roxio forums (DVDitPRO) are STILL having problems with disks not burning. In fact if you turn to page 6 of the manual, it clearly states that BD-r IS NOT SUPPORTED.

EDIT: Sorry MM... the link to the roxio problems are in another thread further down on the Sony board.

"Geeh whiz, give me a break. These hardly stand out as savvy business practices...

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They're not interested in answering questions.... they're simply interested in attacking me..... No big problem... I've got a slack night.

blink convinced me! I will definitely go Blu-Ray now.

"blink convinced me! I will definitely go Blu-Ray now."
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Hey... all the power to ya! It's your decision and far be it for me to tell you otherwise. But then I have made my decision too. :)

Slow progress doesn't bother me. Intentional crippling drives me up the wall. I have spent all kinds of money, time and aggrevation trying to update to HD. None of this means anything if I have to downrez to distribute on DVD. The fact that some some executives in some boardroom somewhere can decide that preventing piracy is more important than people like me being able to distribute our work... yeah I'll support HD DVD. I'd even piss in their boardroom if I knew where it was...

I'd even piss in their boardroom if I knew where it was...
550 Madison Avenue
27th floor
NY NY
10022
(212) 833-8830

Getting past the fifth floor requires some serious brains or a member of floor management with you. Cafeteria on the second floor is amazing.
Laurence, I'd recommend that you ignore this thread and all the FUD associated with it (although it's nice to see an admission that it's deliberate FUD), and research it for yourself.
Burning a BD disc isn't difficult at all. Burning one with menus and interactive features right now is difficult and expensive, as certain aspects of the format weren't frozen/determined until recently. It'll all settle out reasonably soon. There are now several replicators on line, with more to come. It's comical, reading all this BS and recalling the early days of CD authoring, moving from 1630's etc. People back then were tweaky, but at least no one was making up deliberate lies about aspects of the Xover. At least not that I can recall.

"550 Madison Avenue
27th floor
NY NY
10022"

I think I've just lost my nerve... thanks Spot ;-)

Jay,
You're right. Sony is quaking in their boots over only owning 70% of the market.

Fred

PS: This "invitation" wasn't even an invitation, it was an off-the-cuff remark. After reading it again, I'd even say it was tongue in cheek. At the very least it goes with my comment about it being a PR thing-- "look, we're nice guys, we'd even welcome the folks that you all think are our enemies!"

Fred, I never said they were quaking in their boots. I've never said, HD DVD is better than Blue-Ray or even suggested such a thing. The only thing I HAVE said was that if I had to choose between the two right now, I would have to vote for HD DVD simply because it's cheaper. For me it would be a simple matter of economics.

For you to attack me when all I did was ask a genuine and honest question simply goes to show where your head is. Your behavior has been nothing less than disingenuous.

I am taking Douglas' advice and, from this point forward, ignoring this thread.

Well,

As I have stated many times, mergers are destroying the US and the world in terms of choices and in terms of political policies. There is room for both formats and a merger would probably result in a single format (Blu-Ray) which was probably the reason for the original suggestion.

John

EDIT: The "debate" over HD DVD vs Blu-Ray has taken on almost a child-like quality as evidenced by the types of battles that rage on this and other forums.

And although some here say otherwise, for the second year in a row the idea of crushing the competition and touting the unquestionable dominance of Blu-Ray seems to be Sony once again at Cedia 2007 just like at CES last year when they handed out those flyers on the first day of the show. In that same Anand Tech article describing Toshiba at Cedia 2007 no bragging charts, etc as with Sony's display. So who is fueling the childish fight over the candy?