I wouldn't spec a PC for HEVC editing in VEGAS Pro today as it's a work in progress with significant changes already since the release of 21. I'd wait a bit.

That said in general Intel K decoding works well (most of my HEVC performs okay with that) so that CPU seems fine. If it were me I'd save money on the over-spec CPU and motherboard and go to a 13th gen i5 or i9 and maybe z690 get a better GPU than that. I'd also get 2TB m.2 SSDs as the space disappears quickly.

You can see the system I built in my signature and two benchmarks where you can see relative performance in VEGAS (though not with HEVC media).

Thanks @Dexcon & @RogerS for your reply,

Good feedback.

Regarding the drives, I intend to use my existing WD Black HDD as storage for large projects.

I aim to reserve the SSD C drive solely for Windows and programs. Since Windows frequently writes on that drive, I prefer not to store any important project files on it (even though I back them up separately).

Keeping projects on separate drives seems advantageous, so having a separate SSD for projects may be a good idea to enhance read speed, especially on the timeline of Vegas.

What is your opinion on the Core i9-14900K versus the Core i9-13900K?

I've seen mixed reviews about them, suggesting that the 4900 isn't always superior to the 3900. Given the similar pricing, I'm considering purchasing the successor, the 14900K.

@Dexcon why is the integrated GPU (iGPU) required if I buy a separate graphics card?

why is the integrated GPU (iGPU) required if I buy a separate graphics card?

From https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/what-does-enabling-igpu-get-me--141146/

Additionally, if your separate GPU fails (and it has happened to me with previous computers), you have no connection to your monitor until you replace the GPU. If you have a CPU with an iGPU and your separate GPU fails, at least you can plug your monitor into the iGPU until the separate GPU is replaced.

Great thanks for that @Dexcon

The hard drive also needs to cache files so allow space for Windows VEGAS and other programs to do taht.

If you have high data rate media I'd suggest putting working projects on a SSD as well (system disk or a second one) and archive them to the HDD.

The 14th generation and 13th generation perform nearly the same. The i9 have unreasonable heat and power requirements in my opinion and personally went for an i5 which is easily air-cooled. The i7 can do fine air cooled as well. The point of the i9 is to score at the top of benchmarks and be a halo product for Intel demonstrating its superiority to AMD.

The iGPU is for QSV decoding. It's far superior to NVDEC (at least today) in VEGAS for HEVC. Intel is the only GPU maker to accelerate 10-bit 4:2:2 HEVC if you use that type of media.

You would be well advised to check out the reviews of air cooling vs water cooling for the 14900K or 13900K. Water cooling is easy to fit if you choose the right PC case (Lian Li 216 for mid size or Lian Li Lancool III larger case). Even with a Artic Freezer II 420 water cooler I can get 100 degC on some cores while processing images for Astrophotography and this cooler will give at least 10C lower temps than any air cooler, I run 13900K.

@andyrpsmith said: "Even with a Artic Freezer II 420 water cooler I can get 100 degC on some cores while processing images for Astrophotography and this cooler will give at least 10C lower temps than any air cooler, I run 13900K."

I get the temperature that I control for in the UEFI:

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/system-upgrade-2023--137456/?page=3#ca877186

I have my BIOS set to Intel defaults which sets max power draw at 253W, during Cine bench I had max temp on any core 95C at the time I set up the PC last Oct. During image stacking in Pixinsight the Stacking script does a lot of calculations using all cores during the registration stage, fans go full speed and the max temp on three cores hit 100C for 1sec, I guess the water flow cannot respond fast enough even at max pump speed to stop the temp spike. the MB has a switch to allow CPU under-volt but it is obscured by the water radiator at the top of the case. I cannot be bothered at the moment to unscrew the radiator and change it to allow the intel extreme tuning utility to function. Under volting the CPU as you suggest in your post would likely be worthwhile, I had good results doing that with my GTX 1080Ti which made the Starfield game more stable. I have no issues with GPU since changing to the RTX4080-Super (bit of overkill for 1080p) which also works well with Vegas20.

I personally wouldn't recommend air-cooling for a modern desktop unit if you want to get optimal design performance. I replaced the rear chassis fan in a Fractal Design 7 XL case with a single radiator aio on an i9-11900k and it's been great. That was coming from a i9-9900k which could not sustain stock clock rates with a dual-fan Noctua. Not sure a single radiator aio would be sufficient for 13th gen but it would clearly be more suitable than any air cooler, no matter how massive or numerous the fans are in the cooling tower.

I agree with recommendations for a better gpu than the 4060. Personally, for my next build (probably an i9-14900k cpu), I'm thinking of going with a 4090 dual-radiator aio. Another gpu possibility is an Intel Arc Xe3, but those are not expected to hit till 2025. Arc Xe2's are rumored to hit sometime this year but it's not clear if they'll surpass the performance of a 4070.

An airflow optimized case and decent air cooler can handle about 215W in my experience (overclocked 13th gen i5 here).

Thank you all for your feedback.

Regarding water cooling, I'm not sure if I dare to do that. I've seen very scary videos on YouTube where the cooler leaked onto vital PC components. So, to be safe, I think I'll opt for air cooling. I'm open to your feedback if you have other experiences.

Intel vs. HEVC I conducted two test renders at UHD resolution.
Surprisingly, the HEVC rendered faster.
The footage was 23 seconds in length and was rendered using my current system.



HEVC render:



Intel render:



Render setting (during Intel chose Intel in 'Encode mode':



File IO Setting


I have set the Dynamic RAM preview to 0; otherwise, distortions can be seen in renders.

I am curious about your insight on these findings.

VMP

@VMP What are you testing here? This system is ancient. NVIDIA GPUs older than 9XX aren't even supported in VEGAS anymore. File io says Intel UHD but this is a 3rd generation CPU? That's not possible.

What version of VEGAS is this? Dynamic ram preview shouldn't cause artifacts in newer versions (19+).

Mainconcept is a CPU-only render mode which will always be slower than a GPU enabled render.

Feel free to use a render benchmark in my signature so we can do a more controlled test.

Looks like VEGAS 21, judging by the "RAW GPU Decoder to Use" option.

@VMP Below is a link to little read on a post I made about modern CPU's and Vegas, and has some info about what is possible with air-cooling and what to watch out for.

As for your question on getting a 13 or a 14 series i9 processor, that is a no brainer, get the 14 if you build new. If you already have the 13 series then do not bother upgrading/replacing your 13 with a 14 series.

I would also get a 4 TB SSD if possible or at least 2 TB, I already have more than 2 TB in use on my C-drive, that is just programs and games, active projects and a small selection of video and photos. Do not forget if you are getting only 1 TB, you are not getting 1 TB free, some of it is reserved by the SSD itself (for example I can only use 3.63 TB out of 4 TB for the OS, programs and data on my system) ...

The PSU you proposed is also borderline. If money is scarce, I would first spend the money on a stronger PS before anything else, somewhere between 1000 and 1500 watts. It is all about stability, and not what it can and needs to deliver in 'sustained normal use', but what it needs to deliver in split seconds peaks. And modern high end CPU and video cards will draw an incredible amount of current in peak moments before they settle down. If your PS is not strong enough for these peaks it will trip into safety to protect itself and you have an unexplained crash on your hands.

See my specs in the signature

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/solution-to-vegas-crashes-on-modern-high-end-cpu-s-e-g-i9-13900k--144004/#ca901518

I'm not sure about video editing, but I do know with gaming, AMD's flagship absolutely stomps Intel's 14 series flagship CPU, and does so cheaper and uses far less power and generates far less heat along the way. Ditto for multi-core performance.

Thank you all for your feedback.

@RogerS

I was testing the render speed.

CPU: Intel Core i7 3770, Ivy Bridge , Socket 1155 LGA, Cores 4, Threads 8
Age:
Yes I too would call my system old, it is from 2013, that is why I want to upgrade to the latest.
Still working great except render speed and preview frame rate of HEVC UHD files on the timeline.
And getting notification from more apps that my graphics card is not being supported, like Photoshop, Adobe Lightroom, After Effects.

Vegas version: Pro 21 (Build 208)

Dynamic ram preview issues: Isn't this a know issue spanning many Vegas versions? I have another PC I use to render, it too gives similar artifacts during render if RAM preview is above 0 MB. That pc is based on Intel Core i5 3.60GHz Coffee Lake 14nm Technology.

Benchmark: Good one I'll try that on both PC's.

@fr0sty

Vegas Version: Yes that is correct.

@bitman
Thanks I'll look into your tips!
Good one about the power supply watts, better not save money on that.

@fr0sty

AMD:

😬 I am too familiar with intel, I am not sure if I dare try another brand, does it change anything other than the speed of a system, software wise in Windows?

VMP


 

No, everything runs exactly the same, just better, and cheaper.

The only downside is that it doesn't have QSV encoding, but it does have VCE, and you can always get (even better) QSV back by using an Intel GPU alongside it.

As for dynamic ram preview, those issues got fixed in Vegas 19... So if you're still having any, that's very interesting.

Regarding water cooling, I'm not sure if I dare to do that. I've seen very scary videos on YouTube where the cooler leaked onto vital PC components. So, to be safe, I think I'll opt for air cooling. I'm open to your feedback if you have other experiences.

@VMP In that case, I'd expect a low chance of achieving sustained maximum clock rates from an i9-14900k as @RogerS suggests. If you get one anyway, I'd be curious how that works out for you.

My own experience over the past 2 years with my tower case (motherboard standing sideways) is that there has not been a drop of leakage from an aio-cooled 11900k or the 6900xt which has its own independent aio triple radiator. Oddly, last February, there was a sub-zero temperature drop co-incident with a heating system failure in my home while I was away. That event burst some of the copper joints in baseboard heating system radiators. But did not affect aio coolers... I'm guessing that the aio radiators utilize some kind of anti-freeze solution. Needless to say, my closed loop home heating system now runs with anti-freeze too.

Looking through the YouTube videos of water cooling leaks they virtually all relate to custom built - by the user systems rather than AIO ready built systems.

My 2 years old PC (see my signature) is water cooled and had no cooling issues so far. Water cooling, a technique used in almost every vehicle, is a trusted technique I think.

My thoughts on water cooling. If you use an AIO (all in one) water cooler, leaking is kept to a minimum. With Intel, you would need a case that can handle the AIO radiator, and getting something like the highly regarded Arctic Freezer III 420. Review video below. I did use an AIO a few years ago. Enermax on a Ryzen 1700X as I overclocked it. The water cooler died. The computer would boot up, then shut down. I put my hand on the pump and it was hot. So, back to air cooling I went. But Enermax has been problematic with their cooling liquid gunking up the pump fins causing this failure. I haven't gone back to an AIO although I do have an Arctic Freezer AIO new in the box in the closet.

Myself, I am using an all AMD computer, specs in Signature. I am quite happy with it. I don't need a water cooler to have it running. I good quality air cooler is just fine. I am using the Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 in white. Cheap for sure, but one of the best air coolers on the market.

As for the never ending AMD vs Intel, They both have advantages. You need tremendous cooling for Intel, which can act as a space heater in the winter. But it does have the built in iGPU that supports QuickSync. AMD 7000 series CPU's now also come now with an iGPU, but I haven't seen any testing on it and whether it can compete with Intel in that area. From AnandTech, "includes AV1, HEVC, and H.264 video decoding, as well as HEVC and H.264 video encoding." There is more in the article. And there is the advantage of longevity of the AMD platform. The AM4 platform introduced in 2017 is still supported by AMD today, maxing out with the 5000 series CPU's. With my "old" B350 motherboard with the Ryzen 7 1700X CPU, I could have updated to each upgrade (2000, 3000, 5000 series) CPU with just a BIOS update. Of course, later motherboards offer more features, but it shows you the longevity of the platform. My current build had a Ryzen 9 3900X 12core/24thread CPU. I just dropped in a Ryzen 9 5950X 16core/32thread CPU with no problem. How long the current X600 series motherboard support will be is anyone's guess. But it will certainly be at least 2 generations of CPU's.

Arctic AIO

Thermalright Peerless Assassin

Thank you for your detailed response @Reyfox.

Aha, noted, so:

AIO Coolers:
• Minimal leakage risk with reputable brands like Arctic Freezer III 420.
• Adequate for overclocking demands.

Past AIO Experience:
• Enermax cooler failure due to liquid gunking up pump fins.
• Personal experience with Ryzen 1700X; cooler died, necessitating return to air cooling.

Air Cooling Sufficiency:
• Quality air coolers like Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 effectively cool AMD systems.
• Demonstrates effective cooling beyond liquid solutions.

AMD vs Intel Comparison:
• Intel may require more robust cooling; acts as a space heater in winter.
• Intel offers built-in iGPU like QuickSync.
• AMD boasts platform longevity, with AM4 socket still supported across CPU generations.

AMD Platform Longevity:
• AM4 socket supported multiple CPU generations with BIOS updates.
• Example: Ryzen 7 1700X on B350 motherboard could be updated to Ryzen 9 5950X without issue.
• Future support beyond current X600 series motherboards uncertain, but likely extends at least two CPU generations.