Vegas native stabilization vs plugins

Comments

3POINT wrote on 1/12/2019, 12:15 AM

@ Nick Hope

That's true, Deshaker was my favorite stabilizer 10 years ago and was in that time already easy to handle with the Deshaker script. The big disadvantage then and now, it is terribly slow.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300/HCX909, Sony PXW-X160.

Software:VegasPro17/VegasMovieStudio16/PowerDirector16

Hardware:i7 4770, 16GB, GTX650ti, 1920x1200 display

Playware:Philips 55PFL7108

Joelson. wrote on 1/12/2019, 1:57 AM

@Nick Hope @3POINT
I tested the VirtualDub Deshaker that comes in HappyOtter and I was impressed with the result. In some situations the stabilization was better than the native stabilization of Vegas and of the Mercalli V4 plugin.

The slowness, I believe, is due to the fact that in addition to analyzing the timeline event to apply the stabilization, it also renders the final file.

The other stabilizers only parse the event in the timeline and apply the stabilization, but do not process the final file.

3POINT wrote on 1/12/2019, 3:15 AM

@Nick Hope @3POINT
The slowness, I believe, is due to the fact that in addition to analyzing the timeline event to apply the stabilization, it also renders the final file.

The other stabilizers only parse the event in the timeline and apply the stabilization, but do not process the final file.

No, to stabilize the event on the timeline there is first one rendering with a lossless codec of that event, then this rendering is analysed by Deshaker (two passes when I remember right) then the result is rendered again (with lossless codec) and exchanged with the original on the timeline. The final and third rendering is done by Vegas when exporting the project. That is in fact two more renders than applying the other stabilizers.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300/HCX909, Sony PXW-X160.

Software:VegasPro17/VegasMovieStudio16/PowerDirector16

Hardware:i7 4770, 16GB, GTX650ti, 1920x1200 display

Playware:Philips 55PFL7108

Joelson. wrote on 1/12/2019, 7:26 AM

 

No, to stabilize the event on the timeline there is first one rendering with a lossless codec of that event, then this rendering is analysed by Deshaker (two passes when I remember right) then the result is rendered again (with lossless codec) and exchanged with the original on the timeline. The final and third rendering is done by Vegas when exporting the project. That is in fact two more renders than applying the other stabilizers.

 

@3POINT

Thanks,

You were able to explain the process in more detail. That is precisely the reason of te slowness.

Len Kaufman wrote on 1/12/2019, 12:34 PM

@3POINT Thank you. You solve a long-time mystery for me.

AVsupport wrote on 1/12/2019, 10:41 PM

IMO Mercalli4 gives better stabilization when you have a gimbal source. Also benefit is you can use full hardware acceleration, let your GPU do the work! Especially since VP is such a CPU Hog.. Also nice is FX level opposed to the mystery media level hidden agenda. Unfortunately I'm finding issues with Mercalli are: when you have 50p on a 25p timeline, or 50p timeline, 50p souce slowed down to 25p.. exploring..

my current Win10/64 system (latest drivers, water cooled) :

Intel Coffee Lake i5 Hexacore (unlocked, but not overclocked) 4.0 GHz on Z370 chipset board,

16GB (2x8GB Corsair Dual Channel DDR4-2133) XMP-3000 RAM,

Intel 600series 512GB M.2 SSD system drive running Win10/64 home automatic driver updates,

4TB 7200RPM NAS HGST data drive,

Intel HD630 iGPU - currently disabled in Bios,

nVidia GTX1060 6GB, always on latest [creator] drivers. nVidia HW acceleration enabled.

main screen 4K/50p 1ms scaled @175%, second screen 1920x1080/50p 1ms.

3POINT wrote on 1/13/2019, 12:54 AM

Unfortunately I'm finding issues with Mercalli are: when you have 50p on a 25p timeline, or 50p timeline, 50p souce slowed down to 25p.. exploring..

Disable resampling.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300/HCX909, Sony PXW-X160.

Software:VegasPro17/VegasMovieStudio16/PowerDirector16

Hardware:i7 4770, 16GB, GTX650ti, 1920x1200 display

Playware:Philips 55PFL7108

Nick Hope wrote on 1/13/2019, 1:01 AM

@Nick Hope @3POINT
The slowness, I believe, is due to the fact that in addition to analyzing the timeline event to apply the stabilization, it also renders the final file.

The other stabilizers only parse the event in the timeline and apply the stabilization, but do not process the final file.

No, to stabilize the event on the timeline there is first one rendering with a lossless codec of that event, then this rendering is analysed by Deshaker (two passes when I remember right) then the result is rendered again (with lossless codec) and exchanged with the original on the timeline. The final and third rendering is done by Vegas when exporting the project. That is in fact two more renders than applying the other stabilizers.

The input file for Deshaker can be provided by Debugmode Frameserver, instead of an intermediate. HappyOtter can automate all that and bring the final result (or results, if you stabilize a batch) back to the timeline. It's slick but the first analysis pass does take time.

3POINT wrote on 1/13/2019, 1:51 AM

Nevertheless Nick, it's time-consuming.

I must say, the Vegas team did a great job with the new Vegas stabilizer. I'm just waiting for also a batch stabilisation script for it, besides Vegasaur.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300/HCX909, Sony PXW-X160.

Software:VegasPro17/VegasMovieStudio16/PowerDirector16

Hardware:i7 4770, 16GB, GTX650ti, 1920x1200 display

Playware:Philips 55PFL7108

Peter_P wrote on 1/13/2019, 7:16 AM

Many years ago I developed an event FX for Vegas pro to be used with the very good VD Filter Deshaker from G. Thalin. But for performance reasons I stopped working on it and switched to Mercalli V2 with quite good results.

Now I’m using Mercalli V4 as event FX until I get same or better results from the Vegas internal stabilizer.

AVsupport wrote on 1/13/2019, 10:53 PM

Unfortunately I'm finding issues with Mercalli are: when you have 50p on a 25p timeline, or 50p timeline, 50p souce slowed down to 25p.. exploring..

Disable resampling.

unfortunately that's not the magic cream ;-/

my current Win10/64 system (latest drivers, water cooled) :

Intel Coffee Lake i5 Hexacore (unlocked, but not overclocked) 4.0 GHz on Z370 chipset board,

16GB (2x8GB Corsair Dual Channel DDR4-2133) XMP-3000 RAM,

Intel 600series 512GB M.2 SSD system drive running Win10/64 home automatic driver updates,

4TB 7200RPM NAS HGST data drive,

Intel HD630 iGPU - currently disabled in Bios,

nVidia GTX1060 6GB, always on latest [creator] drivers. nVidia HW acceleration enabled.

main screen 4K/50p 1ms scaled @175%, second screen 1920x1080/50p 1ms.

3POINT wrote on 1/13/2019, 11:56 PM

Unfortunately I'm finding issues with Mercalli are: when you have 50p on a 25p timeline, or 50p timeline, 50p souce slowed down to 25p.. exploring..

Disable resampling.

unfortunately that's not the magic cream ;-/

I have used Mercalli in a 24p timeline on 48p media with disabled resampling, no problem!

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300/HCX909, Sony PXW-X160.

Software:VegasPro17/VegasMovieStudio16/PowerDirector16

Hardware:i7 4770, 16GB, GTX650ti, 1920x1200 display

Playware:Philips 55PFL7108