Capturing Old Home Movies

MH7 wrote on 8/29/2022, 12:56 AM

Capturing Old Home Videos

Hi guys,

I can imagine that this subject has come up on this forum before. Nevertheless, on a very old PC I had, it had a TV Tuner card that had the appropriate composite cable connections to be able to connect a VCR to my PC so that I could record old VCR video tape home videos to my old PC at the time. However, as can be seen below, I have a new PC and so I’m looking at the best way to be able to record old VCR video tape videos to the computer I have now that has the same appropriate composite cable connections.

I have looked at the this device by Elgato. Whilst it does seem to have good reviews, it seems to have a max recording resolution of 640x480, whereas, with my old PC’s TV tuner, it could capture at the full PAL resolution of 720x576. Whilst that may not be much of a difference between resolution, I would like to capture at the max resolution of 720x576. I had wondered if this was a hardware limitation of the device or a software limitation of the software that comes with the device, as if I captured the video, with this Elgato device, via VEGAS Pro, could I capture at the full 720x576 resolution instead of the lesser resolution of 640x480.

However, that device aside, I have wondered if there is any real advantage with having a PCIe integrated capture card, that would have the appropriate composite video cables, vs a portable USB device like the Elgato. If anyone can help me out I’d greatly appreciate it. If you need any further clarification as to what I’m asking, please don’t hesitate to ask.

Cheers,

MH7

Please Note: Just for any future replies to my post, I am an Aussie in Australia, hence the preference to want to capture VHS video tapes at the original PAL 720x576 resolution (which, I suppose, when corrected, would be 768x576).

Last changed by MH7

John 14:6 | Romans 10:9-10, 13, 10:17 | Ephesians 2:8-9
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Aussie VEGAS Post 20 User as of 9th February 2023 — Build 411 (Upgraded from VEGAS Pro 18)

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Comments

Former user wrote on 8/29/2022, 4:56 AM

I would want to record all the original information, that would be 50 fields per second at the maximum pal resolution, the recording made is interlaced. What that device appears to do is do the de-interlacing it'self, and then recording is 480P25. It is throwing away 1/2 temporal resolution. It won't playback as smoothly as when your originally played it back using your VCR and TV. That would be my main concern, HOWEVER, I haven't convinced a single person on this forum of how much of a big deal this is, they're quite happy to create 25p/30p videos instead of 50P/60P

As for the resolution. I recall looking at some broadcast TV, recording in both VHS and SVHS, playing back to compare. The SVHS was very much like the original broadcast in quality and resolution, but the VHS was much more inferior in regards to noise and resolution. For that reason if you choose to go the route of this capture device I don't believe 480P should be an issue. If your VHS player has a S-VIdeo output, you would want to use that for a superior signal to the capture card.

I recall there being a number of people that do this with their own tapes or even as a job. They can better advise you. BTW for some of the highest quality results including Time Base Correction (TBC) you can often use old Digital8 or DV Cams you may also have laying around that have an analogue input and can be set to passthrough. You would just need to buy a firewire cable and card. This type of setup allows you to record all the information from your VHS in the highest quality digital to analogue conversion. You will have interlaced video which you can keep, and further convert it to high quality progressive.

If you just like simplicity people swear by that elgato, non technical people, but they do seem to like it (for what it is) for ease of use, and good non buggy software. Like I mentioned there are people here that do this for their job, they'll have more accurate advice for you.

Dexcon wrote on 8/29/2022, 5:33 AM

I have not transferred VHS tapes for quite a while but the following is the process I used:

VHS was played back in a JVC S-Video VHS player (with a TBC) which was connected to a Panasonic MiniDV camera via an S-Video cable. The camera was connected by firewire to an old XP Pentium 4 computer and the video/audio imported to the computer via ULead VideoStudio. Then it was just a matter of copying the imported media to a memory stick or other portable storage device and importing in to my then current editing computer.

I've still got some other VHS to do at some time, so this thread is a timely reminder that it's maybe time to start thinking about dusting off the old XP computer.

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Musicvid wrote on 8/29/2022, 5:58 AM

If you are in the US, and you are capturing VHS (not DVD), you will not gain resolution by capturing at 720x576. You will just be adding air.

MH7 wrote on 8/30/2022, 12:54 AM

I would want to record all the original information, that would be 50 fields per second at the maximum pal resolution, the recording made is interlaced. What that device appears to do is do the de-interlacing it'self, and then recording is 480P25. It is throwing away 1/2 temporal resolution. It won't playback as smoothly as when your originally played it back using your VCR and TV. That would be my main concern, HOWEVER, I haven't convinced a single person on this forum of how much of a big deal this is, they're quite happy to create 25p/30p videos instead of 50P/60P

It’s interesting you mention that, going off topic in this off topic section in this forum of this post of mine, I remember that my older Canon Legria HF G10 records, being the PAL version of the camera (vs the NTSC version of the camera called VIXIA) @1080/50i (it had a 1080/25p recording option, but that recording option always produced blurry motion, even if you set the shutter speed to the common rule of thumb to double the frame rate (my guess is that it was just blending the fields in a bad way that resulted in that problem). However, the video that I recorded with that camera, using the 1080/50i recording option, whilst it played back @25p, if I ran it through Handbrake and used its method of blending the fields and doubling the frame rate to 50p, I would get a smooth 1080/50p video result, which I’s quite impressed with.

That aside, are you saying that if I were able to capture my old video tapes interlaced, instead of having software deinterlacing them, that I could then run that same video through Handbrake, the same as I did for my videos recorded from my older camera above, use Handbrake’s good method of blending the fields (without throwing away half the information), and output them as 50p SD videos instead of 25p videos? If this is the case, I do have a video already captured off one of my old VHS video tapes, that was captured using an old TV Tuner card on my old Intel Q6600 CPU-based HP computer, at, I assume, the full 720x576 PAL resolution that is interlaced and not deinterlaced, so I should be able run that video through Handbrake and output it as a 576/50p video file, correct?

As for the resolution. I recall looking at some broadcast TV, recording in both VHS and SVHS, playing back to compare. The SVHS was very much like the original broadcast in quality and resolution, but the VHS was much more inferior in regards to noise and resolution. For that reason if you choose to go the route of this capture device I don't believe 480P should be an issue. If your VHS player has a S-VIdeo output, you would want to use that for a superior signal to the capture card.

Thanks for this helpful information. I will most probably do that. Just to clarify, though, the TV Tuner/Capture card was on my much older Intel Q6600-based HP PC and I wouldn’t imagine that it would not work with Windows 10 and my newer hardware on my newer 2017-built PC. Although, I have seen some Hauppauge TV Tuner/capture cards that seem to be Windows 10 compatible. I’ll have to look into that.

I recall there being a number of people that do this with their own tapes or even as a job. They can better advise you. BTW for some of the highest quality results including Time Base Correction (TBC) you can often use old Digital8 or DV Cams you may also have laying around that have an analogue input and can be set to passthrough. You would just need to buy a firewire cable and card. This type of setup allows you to record all the information from your VHS in the highest quality digital to analogue conversion. You will have interlaced video which you can keep, and further convert it to high quality progressive.

Thanks for that info. I didn’t know that. My family does have an old Sony Camcorder that does have several different connections on them. I’ll have to have a look at it. Thanks for that advice.

If you just like simplicity people swear by that elgato, non technical people, but they do seem to like it (for what it is) for ease of use, and good non buggy software.

I have actually watched a video on YouTube of a man who used this Elgato device to capture his family’s old VHS and Camcorder videos and he was quite happy with the end result. I have looked into it a decent amount. But I may go the capture card route because of the preservation of the interlaced video, as you have mentioned.

Like I mentioned there are people here that do this for their job, they'll have more accurate advice for you.

Yeah. Well, I appreciate your help. It’s definitely given me some food for thought. Instead of going the quick and easy route with this Elgato device, I will look more extensively into the other possible solutions you mentioned.

Last changed by MH7 on 8/30/2022, 3:05 AM, changed a total of 5 times.

John 14:6 | Romans 10:9-10, 13, 10:17 | Ephesians 2:8-9
————————————————————————————————————

Aussie VEGAS Post 20 User as of 9th February 2023 — Build 411 (Upgraded from VEGAS Pro 18)

VEGAS Pro Help: VEGAS Pro FAQs and TROUBLESHOOTING GUIDES

My YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@TechWiredGeek

Video Cameras: Sony FDR-AX700 and iPhone 12 Pro Max (iOS 17)

============================================

My New Productivity Workstation/Gaming PC 2024

CPU: AMD R7 7800X3D

Motherboard: ASRock X670E Steel Legend (AM5)

RAM: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 Memory

Main SSD: Samsung 980 Pro 1 TB SSD
Storage SSD: Western Digital Black SN850X 2 TB SSD

GPU: Asus TUF GAMING OC Radeon RX 7800 XT (16 GB)

OS: Windows 11 (Build: 23H2)

Main Monitor: LG 27UD88-W 4K IPS

Secondary Monitor: LG 27UL850 4K HDR IPS

MH7 wrote on 8/30/2022, 1:07 AM

If you are in the US, and you are capturing VHS (not DVD), you will not gain resolution by capturing at 720x576. You will just be adding air.

Well, I’m actually in Australia, just for clarification. But thanks for your help. 🙂

John 14:6 | Romans 10:9-10, 13, 10:17 | Ephesians 2:8-9
————————————————————————————————————

Aussie VEGAS Post 20 User as of 9th February 2023 — Build 411 (Upgraded from VEGAS Pro 18)

VEGAS Pro Help: VEGAS Pro FAQs and TROUBLESHOOTING GUIDES

My YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@TechWiredGeek

Video Cameras: Sony FDR-AX700 and iPhone 12 Pro Max (iOS 17)

============================================

My New Productivity Workstation/Gaming PC 2024

CPU: AMD R7 7800X3D

Motherboard: ASRock X670E Steel Legend (AM5)

RAM: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 Memory

Main SSD: Samsung 980 Pro 1 TB SSD
Storage SSD: Western Digital Black SN850X 2 TB SSD

GPU: Asus TUF GAMING OC Radeon RX 7800 XT (16 GB)

OS: Windows 11 (Build: 23H2)

Main Monitor: LG 27UD88-W 4K IPS

Secondary Monitor: LG 27UL850 4K HDR IPS