Doubled render times in 14 compared to 11?

ian-juby wrote on 3/7/2017, 12:08 PM

Hey all,

Just upgraded Vague-us Pro 11 to Vague-us pro 14, and render times on the exact same projects, using exact same settings seemed slower. So I ran a whole mess of tests, and yes - 14 is way slower on the renders. A 5 minute project (project settings 1920X1080 24P) in vegas 11 took about 10 minutes to render in Main Concept AVC with only CPU support because sadly the old vegas would not support GPU acceleration for that codec. But the same settings in vegas 14 takes 20 minutes to render the exact same project. Vegas 14 showed support for GPU with the Main Concept AVC codec, and I experimented with rendering both CUDA and OpenCL. The best it would do was 15 minutes which was half again longer than what old vegas 11 did on CPU only. I experimented with MPEG 2 as I produced my TV show in that codec for the stations, and in version 11 it would rip through a 1/2 hour show in 5 to 10 minutes render time, because it would make use of the GPU. Vegas 14 does not seem to support GPU acceleration in MPEG 2. I experimented with Sony AVC, Magix Prores and Quicktime MOV. I experimented with render settings both matching the project settings as well as resampling to lower res (1280X720). Usually the same project that takes 10 minutes to render in vegas 11 took 20 minutes to render in vegas 14.

For my experiments I deliberately chose a very short, small project using chroma key and colour correction (secondary) as well as HSL adjust. It has overlaid text (open captions), and a total of 4 fade transitions. I upgraded to vegas 14 hoping that the newer version might support GPU acceleration on other codecs, but now not only is it not supporting GPU acceleration (though it gives that option now), I've taken quite a few steps backwards on render time even just using CPU only. What gives?

Hardware:

AMD FX 8350 eight core processor running 4.00 Ghz

24 Gb RAM

Windows 7 pro 64 bit

NVIDIA GeForce GTX 960 graphics card

Using an SSD for OS only, with 4 HDD's to render from one drive to another.

Thanks for the input,

Ian

Comments

CogDiv wrote on 3/7/2017, 1:14 PM

Have an old Radeon that will work in your system? Try that and do some testing . . . Key is the implementation of OpenCL support.

May want to ensure any drivers needed to affirm OpenCL support for the Nvidia card have been installed and tested first. A search for CUDA in this forum should provide more information concerning what support for that still exists.

ian-juby wrote on 3/7/2017, 1:25 PM

Good points, alas, I gave away my Radeon. I'll look into the CUDA and OpenCL support, but if there was an issue in Vegas 14 there, wouldn't it also show up as an issue in Vegas 11? (just asking out loud) And also, that still doesn't address the CPU only rendering. It's just bizarre.

CogDiv wrote on 3/7/2017, 1:39 PM

Your GPU drivers are responsible for OpenCL and CUDA support on the hardware end. The OpenCL and CUDA support that existed in Vegas 13 is still there in 14 from what I've gathered so far. I'm still on 13 and using a Radeon card so I can't really be of much further help.

Think of OpenCL and CUDA as code libraries that sit between the hardware drivers and the application using the hardware. Nvidia says OpenCL support is included with their drivers.

astar wrote on 3/7/2017, 3:40 PM

A lot of older NV cards did not support the version of OpenCL that Vegas 14 might be looking for. You need to look closely at what versions your NV card actually supports. The difference between OpenCL 1.0, 1.1, and 1.2, is like V 1, 3, and 5 in the rest of the software world.

VP11 was recommending an AMD 5770 card capable of OpenCL1.2 and 1200 GFLOPS. Those are the specs I would look at. I cannot confirm this, but I think post Vegas 12 is checking version level and filtering devices. You can confirm via the Shift preferences that vegas filters by GPU memory size.

You may also want to try and install the OpenCL SDK from NV or AMD, if you card is not being seen. It could be possible that something was left out of the driver that Vegas requires.

ian-juby wrote on 3/7/2017, 4:05 PM

Hmmm... thank you - very informative. I did update the drivers for my card for entertainment's sake, and it is running OpenCL 1.2. The card is, evidently, being seen, but showing CUDA only - it does not list OpenCL when you click on the "Check GPU" button. I also just noticed this - for Sony AVC codec, checking the GPU says it's *not* available - though Main Concept shows it as available. I will look into the SDK. This still doesn't explain why CPU only still takes twice as long to render in vegas 14 as it does in vegas 12. Not sure if there's a connection there or not! Thanks for the input.

Musicvid wrote on 3/7/2017, 9:11 PM

Citing dozens of variables makes a weak case for "identical settings."

One source, post project and render properties with no timeline filters, MediaInfo readouts for both source and output with no GPU, and we'll tackle the render times from a single perspective, perhaps?

NickHope wrote on 3/7/2017, 10:07 PM

With your card I would forget GPU-accelerated rendering, which only works well on older cards. See section 2 here.

On Nvidia GPU drivers for Vegas... The GTX 960 is based on Maxwell2 architecture. Magix tell us that the ancient 337.88 driver is required, but others have had success with 372.90, 376.33, 378.49 and 378.66. Of those, 376.33 has mostly positive reports and the 378.XX versions have several reports of problems.

ian-juby wrote on 3/9/2017, 4:51 PM

Thanks Nick. Alas, this is beyond GPU acceleration. Even CPU only is taking 4X as long to render. I'll see if Magix will take a look, but right now this was obviously not worth my money. I was hoping maybe I'd missed something simple, but as we can see by the comments, none of the suggestions were even simple. :)

OldSmoke wrote on 3/9/2017, 5:14 PM

Is your SVP11 32bit or 64bit? Where is your source footage from?