cineform issues

jamie-oxenham wrote on 11/19/2022, 8:57 PM

I'm not sure if a recent windows update has broken my Vegas V19 and now 20. Unfortunately I didnt discover it until recently. My workflow has been to take my canon c70 footage shot in mxf 422 10 bit, and transcode to prores for easier editing and playback.

I also import the prores footage into hitfilm for various compositing work. In the recent past (beginning to mid this year) My workflow is to output from hitfilm as cineform yuv 422 10 bit, and bring into vegas to edit and final grade. This was a great workflow up until a couple of months ago. I upgraded to vegas 20, hoping that would solve my issue that appeared in V19. it didn't :(

The issue is, i don't know when it started, but between August, and last month of this year. Now vegas shows a red, or black screen on all the cineform clips. the prores clips are fine. Just the Hitfilm exports are a problem now. The cineform clip thumbnails show in the timeline ok. i can scrub over the thumbnails in the media bin fine, and they behave as normal. I can even select the cineform clips in the timeline, and the preview window displays them as expected. But if I scrub through any of those cineform clips in the time line, I then start getting a blank preview window, or a red screen. But only on the cineform clips, not the prores.

If I select a region that includes the cineform clip, while that clips preview is black or red, it will render out as a black screen.

Everything seems ok in 8 bit mode, but in 32 bit float, the problems happen. Again, this is recent, so I expect a probable windows update broke something. I have reset vegas, reinstalled hitfilm, reinstalled gopro studio for the codec (just in case) and made sure quicktime was the latest version.

When the cineform clips all go blackout, if I don't touch the mouse, and leave vegas alone for a bit, 'some times' they will re appear again in the preview window, but just until I scrub through the footage again, then back to black and/ or red preview window again. It's like something can't keep up? Also, if the clips are black and or red, and I open the project properties window, then close it without making a single change, the clips all re appear again. until scrubbing through the timeline, then the whole thing starts again. pretty bloody weird if you ask me!

This wasn't really a problem a while ago, on the same pc, with the same settings as always. again, resetting Vegas didn't solve anything.

I have quicktime enabled in deprecated features.

GPU accel is off.

Dynamic ram is 5% of 15790MB, but no setting of that has made a difference.

I'm kinda stumped, as I dont want to downgrade my 10 bit footage to 8 bit, especially when it was working correctly not all that long ago?

It would be great if anyone had any suggestions I haven't found online or in the threads here!

Thank you guys!

Comments

Musicvid wrote on 11/19/2022, 10:07 PM

You may need to download and install the Cineform codec, if you can still find it. It has pretty well faded from current use. Personally, I religiously avoid any Quicktime 32 bit codecs.

As an alternative, you can consider MagicYUV, which actually has better chroma subsampling and shadow noise characteristics than Cineform.

john_dennis wrote on 11/19/2022, 10:28 PM

@jamie-oxenham

If you actually want to diagnose what might have changed you could:

  1. Save a system image with Macrium Reflect Free or Aomei Backupper.
  2. Start removing Windows Updates until something changes.

I usually try to avoid having to shoot those bugs by just restoring a previous backup.

RogerS wrote on 11/20/2022, 5:55 AM

There is a known limitation to using the 32-bit Quicktime plugin- once you exceed a certain number of clips they'll go black as they run out of memory. To avoid that keep files small or better yet avoid any formats that require Quicktime in Vegas. Happily in recent years Vegas added native Apple ProRes support and with affordable paid options like MagicYUV I've been able to keep Quicktime uninstalled.

Musicvid wrote on 11/20/2022, 6:01 AM

The last release of Cineform (GoPro Studio) was in June 2017.