Try starting with MagixAVC, Mainconcept, VBR and use standard bitrates for HD as per the template.

Change project settings to render at "best" quality.

Attempt the render again and see how it looks.

Ten (or more) years ago I had fades with glitches and discovered the encoder/player combo produced the behavior. I discovered the MediaConcept AVC encoder with the MPC player on a specific PC was the problem. Using a different codec, PC or player 'fixed' it. Took me a while to figure it out

Hi,
the media Properties are:
- video event > maintain aspect ratio - loop event - use project resample mode
- media > JPEG - 5184x2920x24

project settings 1920x1080x32 25,000p - Full-resolution rendering quality Best - Adjust source media to better match project or render settings

the render templates are MAGIX AVC/AAC NVENC Internet HD 1080p 25 fps (and I tried all custom combinations)
and the Sony AVC/MVC Internet 1920x 1080-30p (frame rate changed to 25)

I'm now trying MagixAVC, Mainconcept, VBR standard bitrates but the problem is the same, and I tried to use different players and computers but it is the same.

edit: Master Video FX is Levels > Computer RGB to Studio RGB

Hi,
the media Properties are:
- video event > maintain aspect ratio - loop event - use project resample mode
- media > JPEG - 5184x2920x24

Please give the MediaInfo following this tutorial: https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/faq-how-to-post-mediainfo-and-vegas-pro-file-properties--104561/

project settings 1920x1080x32 25,000p - Full-resolution rendering quality Best - Adjust source media to better match project or render settings

Screenshot of your projectproperties tells us more

@john.b

• Posting on youtube is not a valid tool to show us the artifacts in your video since youtube re-encodes anything you upload. Upload your example file to a cloud share for us to download and add the link on this forum.

​​​​​​​

• The biggest issue with your example is 'complexity' of the content, not to mention the crossfade which essentially changes every pixel in every frame.

Than you for the link...

General
Complete name                            : C:\Test 10.000.mp4
Format                                   : MPEG-4
Format profile                           : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID                                 : mp42 (isom/mp42)
File size                                : 13.9 MiB
Duration                                 : 12 s 200 ms
Overall bit rate                         : 9 535 kb/s
Encoded date                             : UTC 2022-06-26 11:20:07
Tagged date                              : UTC 2022-06-26 11:20:07Video
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : High@L4
Format settings                          : CABAC / 3 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
Format settings, Reference frames        : 3 frames
Format settings, GOP                     : M=1, N=30
Codec ID                                 : avc1
Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                                 : 12 s 200 ms
Bit rate                                 : 9 533 kb/s
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 25.000 FPS
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.184
Stream size                              : 13.9 MiB (100%)
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 2022-06-26 11:20:07
Tagged date                              : UTC 2022-06-26 11:20:07
Color range                              : Limited
Codec configuration box                  : avcC

https://1drv.ms/v/s!AimONGwoSjOGpF38Y3Uj557xQxQi?e=mkvzyQ

@john.b

Here's the bit rate distribution for your file from Bit Rate Viewer.

The peak bit rate is probably insufficiently to handle the detail changes.

As a test, try these settings and report.

Also, consider using Voukoder with custom settings CRF 20, GOP 15, B Frame = 0.

None of these may be practical, but we need to eliminate the encoder.

Do you see it still after the tip of @john_dennis you can try to change the projectsettings this way:

@john.b

How does this crossfade look to you.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OE1vS7scRlbRa-XDM0cr6AbNJWZG03PR/view?usp=sharing

General
Complete name                            : E:\OBS Captures\Render This 28-50.mp4
Format                                   : MPEG-4
Format profile                           : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID                                 : mp42 (isom/mp42)
File size                                : 20.9 MiB
Duration                                 : 6 s 960 ms
Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
Overall bit rate                         : 25.2 Mb/s
Encoded date                             : UTC 2022-06-26 18:10:09
Tagged date                              : UTC 2022-06-26 18:10:09

Video
ID                                       : 2
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : High@L4.1
Format settings                          : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
Format settings, Reference frames        : 4 frames
Codec ID                                 : avc1
Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                                 : 6 s 960 ms
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                 : 25.0 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate                         : 50.0 Mb/s
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 25.000 FPS
Standard                                 : PAL
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.482
Stream size                              : 20.7 MiB (99%)
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 2022-06-26 18:10:11
Tagged date                              : UTC 2022-06-26 18:10:11
Color range                              : Limited
Color primaries                          : BT.709
Transfer characteristics                 : BT.709
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.709
Codec configuration box                  : avcC

Audio
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : AAC LC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Audio Codec Low Complexity
Codec ID                                 : mp4a-40-2
Duration                                 : 6 s 955 ms
Bit rate mode                            : Variable
Bit rate                                 : 192 kb/s
Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
Channel layout                           : L R
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate                               : 46.875 FPS (1024 SPF)
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Stream size                              : 160 KiB (1%)
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 2022-06-26 18:10:10
Tagged date                              : UTC 2022-06-26 18:10:10

Tried all suggestions, Hi Profile VBR 28.000.000-50.000.000, disable resample, Voukoder with custom settings, but the problem is still here.
If I crossfade the images (no black screen in the middle) the exported video is perfect, also with 10.000.000 constant bit rate, so I'm now going to crossfade all the images... because I need this video.

Thank you for your time and please let me know if there are any other suggestions.

@john.b Hi, you posted earlier '- media > JPEG - 5184x2920x24' , can you share those files on Google Drive or another site?

Is it the square 'pixel' type effect on the blue sky that's the problem?

I get that if i render 4k at a bitrate that's too low but it sounds like you've already tried higher bitrates, would still like to have a play with your orig files.

@john.b As pointed out in John's bitrate graph, your minimum bitrate is too low for a clean transition. Do this and you should be OK:

1. Don't use NVENC in the Magix AVC renderer. Do use Mainconcept.
2. Use Two Pass, Variable Bitrate and set both the Maximum and Average bitrate values at the same value, 20,000,000. This will force a higher minimum bitrate.
3. If you eventually get Voukoder, x264 is better at modest bitrates, and I will be happy to show you how to set vbv-bufsize and vbv-maxrate to optimize your encode during fade transitions.

@john.b Hi, you posted earlier '- media > JPEG - 5184x2920x24' , can you share those files on Google Drive or another site?

Is it the square 'pixel' type effect on the blue sky that's the problem?

I get that if i render 4k at a bitrate that's too low but it sounds like you've already tried higher bitrates, would still like to have a play with your orig files.

The files are here
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AimONGwoSjOGpF5Ff9d_d_N5UVjJ?e=bXtPtS
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AimONGwoSjOGpF8yAyq7v2ZCUTrl?e=wmtCCa

No, I think the square 'pixel' type effect in your image is a "degradation" applied by OneDrive, if you download the video you can see that the problem is there but is not so pronounced.

@john.b As pointed out in John's bitrate graph, your minimum bitrate is too low for a clean transition. Do this and you should be OK:

1. Don't use NVENC in the Magix AVC renderer. Do use Mainconcept.
2. Use Two Pass, Variable Bitrate and set both the Maximum and Average bitrate values at the same value, 20,000,000. This will force a higher minimum bitrate.
3. If you eventually get Voukoder, x264 is better at modest bitrates, and I will be happy to show you how to set vbv-bufsize and vbv-maxrate to optimize your encode during fade transitions.

I tried the passages 1 and 2, unfortunately I get the same result as before; please, share your the settings for Voukoder, I tried the settings suggested by john_dennis (CRF 20, GOP 15, B Frame = 0) and the fades seem a little better, but the problem is still there.

If I crossfade (overlap) the two images, all is fine; the problem is when I make slow fades from/to a black screen.

To continue testing in the agreeable environment @john_dennis suggests, do this:

This is somewhat similar to what I suggested above; by constraining the range of practical bitrates closer to the peak, the minimum bitrate is not allowed to dip low enough to cause visible artifacts.

If that doesn't help, look closely at your rendered file and what is being dished by Youtube, which is known as the unchallenged king of artifacts. Unfortunately, there is little meaningful you can do; when it comes to us vs. Youtube, the tail does not wag the dog.

Here is a link to a new test I rendered accordingly; note that I have not loaded it to Youtube or the forum player directly to avoid upstream processing, which is destructive.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/11RZt2EPt928_JhTJ7TmOBNK3HsnHNqJq/view?usp=sharing

@john.b

I tried these settings and I'm watching your test (dowloaded), I think it is better now but the artifacts in the fades are always there, and when the video is re-coded by Youtube it is even worse.

Surely, as john_dennis says,the biggest problem may just be the "complexity" of the content.

Anyway I decided to make the video with shorter fades or crossfades to minimize artifacts.

Thank you all for your time and advice, now I know a lot more than before.

Although my eyesight is pretty compromised, I can't see any artifacts in my version I uploaded version on VLC at 1:1 resolution. Many of us have turned to various forms of crossfades and smart transitions instead of FI / FO.

If I stop the video I see these strange "waves" in the sky during the fade out, and I see these "things"also during playback

With the other image the problem is minimized because the fade in is pretty fast, but with slow fades (to/from black) I can see the artifacts.

It probably also depends on the type of video player, but I have tried different video players and the result is the same

@john.b Hi, thanks for sharing the files, I downloaded your video, the sky is a lot smoother & I see the waves as you posted above but am still struggling to see these artifacts, can you share a screen capture or a frame no, ?

This is typical and common in 8bit-pixel format because the grayscale (16-235) can't cover across big and flat "distance" like blue sky which from this side to that side may be only different in 3-5 scales.

Profis shoot their source usually in 422 subsamling for the post edit.

32bit-floating-point editing again keeps such artifacts far away.

And in the post there're rules which filter should be adjusted firstly, which at last etc.

Here 2 videos from same source, but the used filters in different sequence.

Hitchcock: If I see a fade there, I know something went wrong.

If I stop the video I see these strange "waves" in the sky during the fade out, and I see these "things"also during playback

With the other image the problem is minimized because the fade in is pretty fast, but with slow fades (to/from black) I can see the artifacts.

It probably also depends on the type of video player, but I have tried different video players and the result is the same

The waves as you call them is in fact color banding: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colour_banding

If I stop the video I see these strange "waves" in the sky during the fade out, and I see these "things"also during playback

With the other image the problem is minimized because the fade in is pretty fast, but with slow fades (to/from black) I can see the artifacts.

It probably also depends on the type of video player, but I have tried different video players and the result is the same

The waves as you call them is in fact color banding: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colour_banding

 

@Illusion is 100% correct.

8-bit banding cannot be improved by any encoding setting; It must be eliminated at the source. It is being exaggerated by the gradated fade.

In this case, you would shoot your stills at 10-bit depth or greater, process them in a 32-bit float project, and render to a 10-bit depth codec. Of course, you would want to view them on an HDR monitor or teevee.

There are those few internet alchemists and pundits who will tell you that grading and/or rendering in 32-bit float domain alone is enough to reduce banding. In reality, it just adds a crude dithering effect by virtue of spurious frequency noise occupying the lower two vacant bits, so it is a destructive collateral, not a solution.