Failure to render virtual choir

KingGeorgeXX wrote on 4/16/2021, 3:26 PM

I recently started a project for my church. I was to create a virtual choir of approximately 30 members synced to music. The files I received were predominately MP4 format with a few MOVs mixed in that appeared to be shot with iPhone. The MP4 files were recorded on a computer with a program designed for the purpose of giving the singer music to follow while recording the singer's video and the singer's voice only (not the backing track). On my timeline, I then had to sync the singer's video and audio voice track with a master accompaniment track. This means that for each performer you created two tracks (video and audio). When I finished the syncing process I had 60 tracks. All videos were not created equally, I had to use a little brightness/contrast and color correction on several tracks. The same with audio, I had to use some eq and compression. I say all that to give an idea of the data that was building up on these tracks. I then used the PIP effect to size each video to fit on the screen. I decided to use 5-6 PIPs per 15-second screenshot of each set of performers. This was an effort to take some of the load off the processor, (which I only theorized would help). Then I tried to render to MP4 format.....The first render I was able to get a complete render (not sure how that happened) but I found some tracks were slightly out of sync. After making the adjustments, the program would render anywhere from 40%- 86% and then crash. Never got a finished product.

I am using an Alienware Aurora 7R with intel i7 6 core processor, Windows 10, and Vegas Pro v18 (just upgraded). On occasion during rendering, I would use the progress feature to see how the processor was performing. Most times the processor was being used at 75-85% capacity while the memory was cruising along at around 3.5 GB. I had upgraded my RAM to 64 GB for this project. The frame rate could be one of the problems because I noticed that some of the videos were shot on an iPhone, the majority of the videos were recorded using a computer and program designed for this purpose. I have two hard drives, the Vegas program is on my C drive which has approximately 40GB of free space. My source videos are on the D Drive which has 2 TB with 1.3 TB of free space. I was rendering to the D: drive.

This type of project is very popular with houses of worship at this time and I was creating this video for our church. I have seen videos of a virtual choir with 50 or more singers in one screenshot, synced to music. I thought for sure Vegas could accomplish this task. I've been using Vegas since Version 4 and never had a problem until this project from Heaven. It has stumped me. Any suggestions on how to manage the files, what precautions need to be made during the recording process, should an iPhone not be used to record, the best technique for sizing videos, and should it be possible to create a virtual choir with say 35 singers on one screen with Vegas? Has anyone out there been successful creating a virtual choir in Vegas, and if so, what techniques did you use? Your help is very appreciated because I know the choir director will be wanting to do this again.

PS Windows and Vegas are on same drive.

Comments

Reyfox wrote on 4/16/2021, 3:37 PM

Here is a virtual choir done with Vegas Post by the Moderator Set. There is another video done with Vegas Pro, can't remember the link.

I don't know the specifics on what files he received, but I wouldn't trust cellphone videos because they are usually variable frame rate devices. I would convert them to constant frame rate with something like Handbrake which is free, replace them on the timeline track and then try an render.

Also try rendering smaller parts of the timeline and see where a rendering problem might occur. I am sure the more knowledge people here will add/correct/guide much better than I.

set wrote on 4/16/2021, 6:47 PM

Thanks @Reyfox for referring my video as an example of what can be accomplished with VEGAS Pro / VEGAS Post.

"should it be possible to create a virtual choir with say 35 singers on one screen with Vegas?"

YES! very possible. And I just watched the very recent Virtual Online choir done by user @Ken-Theriot here:

Discussion here: https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/75-pip-or-similar-for-virtual-choir--125511/

And another creation by user @kirsten-v here:

Discussion here: https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/making-a-video-from-a-choir--120370/

And more by user Massimo Rossi:

Short discussion on how to do it in FB group Vegas editor's hub: https://www.facebook.com/groups/637234203382861/permalink/899442927161986/

We can't avoid the fact that this type of project, each singer's source video were recorded on Android cellphones or iPhones which having variable frame rates, and also a high-compressed MP4s (or HEVC of iPhone) - and my gratitude upon this goes to Massimo Rossi where last year he advised to change it to Apple ProRes (or previously Magix Intermediate format) for each choir videos. In my very first choir project, I tried MP4 files directly too and it is unstable and felt my PC is 'exhausted'-totally and collapsed (crashed).

Besides of just converting the MP4 sources directly, you can try color correcting together as well during 'file-preparation-session' (also Flip Horizontal the video as well in case recording in mirror mode) so you have better balance of each singer in sync-ing and mixing in later 'main-editing-session'. - And here's what I did for this project:

I change all to Black and White and 'balance' the 'lighting' (lighten the subject and darken the white background) while also convert it to ProRes.

Similarly for this too:

I never monitoring the task manager and processing power during editing, but I assume that MP4 decoding requires more processing while ProRes, even though it results to large file size, but more stable (is it less-processing power? I don't know - but probably it is).

set wrote on 4/16/2021, 7:08 PM

Add:

If you have completely edited them and really having trouble in the end during rendering, then you can try render them part by part, perhaps every 30 seconds or per-lyric, to Apple ProRes / Magix Intermediate, then render them to final delivery format from these ProRes / Intermediate files.

Musicvid wrote on 4/16/2021, 10:26 PM

I never monitoring the task manager and processing power during editing, but I assume that MP4 decoding requires more processing while ProRes, even though it results to large file size, but more stable (is it less-processing power? I don't know - but probably it is).

That is absolutely correct. The more compression a file has, the more processing it takes to unpack.

kirsten-v wrote on 4/17/2021, 2:29 AM

Nice to see my video mentioned here. Thanks @set In the end I renderend in parten off 15 seconds. That helpen slot. Save alot off time ro finetune the video. My computer had trouble with showing the preview. So somethings I so in the actual video.