Rendering Issue

robert-engle wrote on 8/22/2017, 1:14 PM

I'm not great at this editing like you guys yet so sorry ran into a small issue. Ok here goes.
1. Shot some video in 4K resolution at 50 frames second. Sunny day used a ND filter as always
2. Put footage just on my computer, and yes a "4K monitor," and wow the small 30 second video clip is so clear I cant believe it.
3. Put it into Sony Vegas Pro 13 and just did a render on that small clip to see what it would look like but I only see a choice for render in 4K at 30 frames a second.
4. I did that because I did not see a choice for 24 FPS and the video clip does not look as good as being on my computer. 
5. Does rendering at 30FPS make a huge problem because it wasn't 24FPS like this or is this something else? 
6. Finally get to where I can video perfect after years and now I cant edit it or render it where it looks good. 
7. Here is what exactly it says when I go to render and pull up the menu, " 8 Mbps HD 1080-30P Video 4K 30 FPS 100 Sharp" This is what I rendered in. 
8. Also noticed my file that looked awesome was about 240 megabytes for the 25 seconds. When it was rendered it was 39.2 megabytes ????? Is this part of the issue losing the file size??????????????????
9.  In Sony Vegas my project files are the same resolution as shooting and my preview is perfect also. 
I have  good video card etc and don't have any problems playing 4K.  I also see there are lots of setting when setting up a render not just to choose 4K but things like Field Order, aspect ratio, frame rate, pixel format for bit rate, motion blur, etc.
Like I said I have watched a few You-Tube videos but they touch on basics not in depth so something is off here.  Bottom line my render is not clear like my project media. 

PLEASE HELP 
Bob

Comments

Former user wrote on 8/22/2017, 1:20 PM

Your original is 50 fps. You should keep it at 50fps for best quality. You should see a drop down for framerate in the render options.

robert-engle wrote on 8/22/2017, 1:26 PM

Already tried that makes no difference

 

robert-engle wrote on 8/22/2017, 1:40 PM

Also was shooting at 24 Fps but my shutter was at 1/050 for video

Musicvid wrote on 8/22/2017, 1:51 PM

You said 50fps then you said 24 fps.

If your video FRAME RATE is 50 fps, render at 50 fps.

If your video frame rate is 24 fps, render at 24 fps.

SHUTTER SPEED has zero to do with frame rate.

robert-engle wrote on 8/22/2017, 2:24 PM

Video was taken at 4K 24fps. my SHUTTER was manually set to 50 to remove that jello effect. Video is perfect rendering is the issue

robert-engle wrote on 8/22/2017, 6:13 PM

Ok tried that template and I had sound and just a black screen. I put every setting in just the same as your picture. Tried a few different ways and still does not look the same as my original file. It should be exactly as shot correct?? What now???

Thanks

OldSmoke wrote on 8/22/2017, 6:49 PM

Ok tried that template and I had sound and just a black screen. I put every setting in just the same as your picture. Tried a few different ways and still does not look the same as my original file. It should be exactly as shot correct?? What now???

Thanks


First things first. You shoot in 4K at 24fps, right? You edit in 4K 24fps, right? How would like to watch your video? Do you have a 4K TV or you want to post it in 4K on YouTube? Or do you just want to watch is on your computer in 4K?

The template by provided by Cornico will not only render it on 1080p but also in 50p, both is different from you recording. I also "assume" that your 24fps is actually 23.976fps? You can use a small little software called "MediaInfo" to check the exact frame rate. It would also be good to know if that is variable or constant frame rate, you didn't specify what codec the camera records in.

So if you would like to watch it on a 4K TV or upload it to YouTube in 4K, try this template; adjust the frame rate if it doesn't match you source material.

If you want to retain as much of quality as you recorded, you must render it to a codec with a similar bitrate, like XAVC-I but you will not be able to watch the rendered file on your TV. You might be able to upload it to YouTube but it will take a long time to upload and another long time to process.

So, let us know what actually expect from your video after you have edited it.

Edit: Also let us know your system spec, especially graphic card and driver as that could be a reason why you see no video but can hear music.

Last changed by OldSmoke on 8/22/2017, 6:50 PM, changed a total of 1 times.

Proud owner of Sony Vegas Pro 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 & 13 and now Magix VP15&16.

System Spec.:
Motherboard: ASUS X299 Prime-A

Ram: G.Skill 4x8GB DDR4 2666 XMP

CPU: i7-9800x @ 4.6GHz (custom water cooling system)
GPU: 1x AMD Vega Pro Frontier Edition (water cooled)
Hard drives: System Samsung 970Pro NVME, AV-Projects 1TB (4x Intel P7600 512GB VROC), 4x 2.5" Hotswap bays, 1x 3.5" Hotswap Bay, 1x LG BluRay Burner

PSU: Corsair 1200W
Monitor: 2x Dell Ultrasharp U2713HM (2560x1440)

robert-engle wrote on 8/22/2017, 7:22 PM

Ok yes my video setting say 4K 24fps so yes. I mainly watch my video at home on my PC, sometimes on You-Tube but many times give clips to friend on Discs that I want 4K. My monitor yes is 4K and my video card. Yes also you are correct 24fps at 23.976. It is also showing these exact settings in my preview in Sony Vegas.

I believe the Codec is H264 it looks like.

Yes so my goal is to watch on my computer but sometimes You-tube and friends to view. Like I said on just my computer before it goes into Vegas it's the best footage I have ever seen finally. I wish I could send the 2 small clips so you could see the difference. Computer has 8TB of memory, Windows 7 Professional, i7 Octocore 3.6 GHZ, 16GB of Ram, 64 Bit operating system, 2 Graphics cards. One dedicated to pictures that is a GeForce 560TI. The other is just for video and I believe is a GeForce 760 or 960Ti cant remember.

Hope this helps I will wait for a direction to go from you.

Thank You

OldSmoke wrote on 8/22/2017, 7:38 PM

Ok yes my video setting say 4K 24fps so yes. I mainly watch my video at home on my PC, sometimes on You-Tube but many times give clips to friend on Discs that I want 4K. My monitor yes is 4K and my video card. Yes also you are correct 24fps at 23.976. It is also showing these exact settings in my preview in Sony Vegas.

I believe the Codec is H264 it looks like.

Yes so my goal is to watch on my computer but sometimes You-tube and friends to view. Like I said on just my computer before it goes into Vegas it's the best footage I have ever seen finally. I wish I could send the 2 small clips so you could see the difference. Computer has 8TB of memory, Windows 7 Professional, i7 Octocore 3.6 GHZ, 16GB of Ram, 64 Bit operating system, 2 Graphics cards. One dedicated to pictures that is a GeForce 560TI. The other is just for video and I believe is a GeForce 760 or 960Ti cant remember.

Hope this helps I will wait for a direction to go from you.

Thank You


You do have a bit of a conflict. "many times give clips to friend on Discs" Do you mean on a USB drive or similar? You cant get 4K onto a BluRay disc, not yet, and certainly not onto a DVD.

"Yes so my goal is to watch on my computer but sometimes You-tube and friends to view"

If you want every to be able to watch your video in 4K, try the template I suggested. You can increase to bitrate if the result isn't good enough. All your graphic cards are Nvidia cards which could be the reason you are having issues encoding and playing it back. Please check which GPU is enabled in Vegas and which driver you have installed.

"I believe the Codec is H264 it looks like."

Please use MediaInfo and report back the result.

Proud owner of Sony Vegas Pro 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 & 13 and now Magix VP15&16.

System Spec.:
Motherboard: ASUS X299 Prime-A

Ram: G.Skill 4x8GB DDR4 2666 XMP

CPU: i7-9800x @ 4.6GHz (custom water cooling system)
GPU: 1x AMD Vega Pro Frontier Edition (water cooled)
Hard drives: System Samsung 970Pro NVME, AV-Projects 1TB (4x Intel P7600 512GB VROC), 4x 2.5" Hotswap bays, 1x 3.5" Hotswap Bay, 1x LG BluRay Burner

PSU: Corsair 1200W
Monitor: 2x Dell Ultrasharp U2713HM (2560x1440)

robert-engle wrote on 8/22/2017, 7:49 PM

I'm sorry I meant give them a thumb-drive. Like I said just put into the computer before it goes into Vegas it's perfect. When I render is the issue. At this point I would just be happy if you could help me get it rendered JUST LIKE I SEE IT BEFORE IT'S RENDERED on my computer and I would be thrilled !!!!!

Ok must be up early am I will try your settings tomorrow night. Please let me know anything else I need before tomorrow.

THANK YOU

Musicvid wrote on 8/22/2017, 9:17 PM

Use the Internet template in Vegas that most closely matches your source.

It would seem there is nothing out of the ordinary with your source, so the solution may be less challenging than you think.

Get some sleep.

3POINT wrote on 8/23/2017, 4:01 AM

Like I said just put into the computer before it goes into Vegas it's perfect. When I render is the issue. At this point I would just be happy if you could help me get it rendered JUST LIKE I SEE IT BEFORE IT'S RENDERED on my computer and I would be thrilled !!!!!

I don't see a problem when you just use the standard 4k rendertemplate:

It will give you a videofile with same resolution and framerate as your original footage. This makes sense when watching on a 4k display. When watching on a FHD display only, this makes no sense, than use the Internet 1080p template just below, which makes than sense.

Last changed by 3POINT on 8/23/2017, 4:06 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5 and co-founder and moderator of the Dutch Vegasforum https://vegasvideoforum.nl/index.php

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket 3, Samsung S24, DJI Mavic Mini, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300

Software: Vegaspro365+Vegasaur, Davinci Resolve 20, PowerDirector365

Hardware: i910900k, 32GB, GTX2080super, 2x1920x1200 display

Playware: Samsung Qled QE65Q6FN

robert-engle wrote on 8/23/2017, 5:10 AM

I just looked in my Main Concept like your picture I have nothing that says "Internet 4K 2160P', In Sony Vegas Pro 13 ??

3POINT wrote on 8/23/2017, 9:01 AM

The template is from Vegas Pro 14 and can also be used in Vegas Pro 13 by manually changing the values from an existing Mainconcept template with the values as shown in screenshot. You can even save that template with "Internet 4k 2160p" name for future use.

I wonder that Cornico is not able to give such an advice!

3POINT wrote on 8/23/2017, 11:25 AM

At the moment there are not many 4k Cameras which can record in 50/60p. Also with 4k, the resolution 3840x2160 is normally meant. By using/creating a 4k Internet 2160p rendertemplate eventually changing manually the (max) framerate to 60 fps, this template creates a 3840x2160 videofile which automatically takes over the framerate of the videoproject (24/25/30/48/50/60 fps) as long it is max 60fps.

Last changed by 3POINT on 8/23/2017, 11:25 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

3POINT, Theo Houben, Vegasuser since version 5 and co-founder and moderator of the Dutch Vegasforum https://vegasvideoforum.nl/index.php

Recware: DJI Osmo Pocket 3, Samsung S24, DJI Mavic Mini, GoproHero7Black, PanasonicFZ300

Software: Vegaspro365+Vegasaur, Davinci Resolve 20, PowerDirector365

Hardware: i910900k, 32GB, GTX2080super, 2x1920x1200 display

Playware: Samsung Qled QE65Q6FN

3POINT wrote on 8/23/2017, 11:33 AM

3. Put it into Sony Vegas Pro 13 and just did a render on that small clip to see what it would look like but I only see a choice for render in 4K at 30 frames a second.

I just looked in my Main Concept like your picture I have nothing that says "Internet 4K 2160P', In Sony Vegas Pro 13 ??

I`m wondering which 4k30 rendertemplate you saw VPro13?

robert-engle wrote on 8/23/2017, 8:25 PM

Ok had a major issue today so was not able to do to much today or try a template. I did just quickly took the file off the computer,"Not from Sony Vegas', and uploaded right from my computer to You-Tube. I labeled it as 4K Upload test and the link is here below. It's just a small 25 second or so clip over a stream bed. Again right from the computer not out of Vegas and not edited at all. So what I see on my computer at least and on You-Tube is in 4K and doesn't look to bad to me but cant seem to get this from a render. Please watch and you guys tell me what you think of the quality of the video?? I think it looks good and I believe it's in 4K. So bottom line I want to edit my clips like this in Vegas and render them to look like this!!!!!!! I do know sometimes quality also changes on sites like this. I have watched it on You-Tube so please go to my site. It's Heli4213

I'm sure it will be better there than if you click below as I watched the one here and it's not as good as right on You-Tube.

Thank you all and hopefully soon with all of your help we can fix this.

 

3POINT wrote on 8/23/2017, 11:12 PM

Did you try to render with the template settings as described above?

robert-engle wrote on 8/24/2017, 6:54 AM

Will try tonight as I have more time. Did you go to Heli4213 to look at video?

 

robert-engle wrote on 8/24/2017, 6:56 AM

Also in addition to the problem rendered video was a little jumpy. I assume all part of the issue?

3POINT wrote on 8/24/2017, 7:11 AM

Youtube is not a good place to judge the quality of a video, because youtube will render your upload again. To share the full quality of your footage and it's renderresult, a file hosting service like dropbox is better.

When the rendered output is choppy, that can happen when you render with another framerate than the originalframerate. The original footage can also already be choppy when the combination low framerate high shutterspeed is used.

robert-engle wrote on 8/24/2017, 7:18 AM

I was told the standard practice was if you are shooting at 24fps the. The shutter should be double that. Shutter at 50. This worked out perfect because I saw the video again the rendering is the issue. It looks perfect on the computer and in You-tune I already watched it. Go watch it !!!!!

OldSmoke wrote on 8/24/2017, 9:00 AM

I was told the standard practice was if you are shooting at 24fps the. The shutter should be double that. Shutter at 50. This worked out perfect because I saw the video again the rendering is the issue. It looks perfect on the computer and in You-tune I already watched it. Go watch it !!!!!

I am sorry but there is no issue with rendering as long as you are doing it right. I have done countless 4K projects in the past three years and they all look stunning.

Have you finally tried the rendering templates that where suggested?

You can also use the Sony XAVC-S 3840x2160 24p template in VP13. The files will be bigger, take a long time to upload and may not play on all devices but will have very high quality.

Proud owner of Sony Vegas Pro 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 & 13 and now Magix VP15&16.

System Spec.:
Motherboard: ASUS X299 Prime-A

Ram: G.Skill 4x8GB DDR4 2666 XMP

CPU: i7-9800x @ 4.6GHz (custom water cooling system)
GPU: 1x AMD Vega Pro Frontier Edition (water cooled)
Hard drives: System Samsung 970Pro NVME, AV-Projects 1TB (4x Intel P7600 512GB VROC), 4x 2.5" Hotswap bays, 1x 3.5" Hotswap Bay, 1x LG BluRay Burner

PSU: Corsair 1200W
Monitor: 2x Dell Ultrasharp U2713HM (2560x1440)