Vegas 13: Weird behavior when I load clips

vegas13 wrote on 10/31/2022, 3:11 PM

Hi, I have a problem with some clips. For some reason, when I load them on Vegas, as I go frame by frame, some are duplicated, it misses a frame, so it looks less smooth than when I play it with a video player like VLC or whatever. I also noticed there is an extra tiny amount sometimes that ignores the snapping option (it's enabled). And sometimes when I extend the clip to the point it loops, the first frame after the loop begins is the last frame of the video, really weird. This is screwing up my project. Here's a media info from a clip im trying to use:

 

  • Format                                   : MPEG-4
  • Format profile                           : Base Media
  • Codec ID                                 : isom (isom/iso2/avc1/mp41)
  • File size                                : 20.0 MiB
  • Duration                                 : 6 s 223 ms
  • Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
  • Overall bit rate                         : 26.9 Mb/s
  • Writing application                      : Lavf59.16.100
  • Video
  • ID                                       : 1
  • Format                                   : AVC
  • Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
  • Format profile                           : High@L4.1
  • Format settings                          : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
  • Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
  • Format settings, Reference frames        : 4 frames
  • Codec ID                                 : avc1
  • Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
  • Duration                                 : 6 s 167 ms
  • Bit rate                                 : 27.1 Mb/s
  • Nominal bit rate                         : 25.0 Mb/s
  • Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
  • Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
  • Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
  • Frame rate mode                          : Constant
  • Frame rate                               : 30.000 FPS
  • Color space                              : YUV
  • Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
  • Bit depth                                : 8 bits
  • Scan type                                : Progressive
  • Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 0.436
  • Stream size                              : 20.0 MiB (100%)
  • Writing library                          : x264 core 164
  • Encoding settings                        : cabac=1 / ref=3 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=hex / subme=7 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.00 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=1 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=34 / lookahead_threads=5 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / bluray_compat=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=2 / b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / weightb=1 / open_gop=0 / weightp=2 / keyint=12 / keyint_min=1 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=12 / rc=abr / mbtree=1 / bitrate=25000 / ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=0 / qpmax=69 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
  • Codec configuration box                  : avcC
  • Audio
  • ID                                       : 2
  • Format                                   : AAC LC
  • Format/Info                              : Advanced Audio Codec Low Complexity
  • Codec ID                                 : mp4a-40-2
  • Duration                                 : 6 s 223 ms
  • Source duration                          : 6 s 246 ms
  • Bit rate mode                            : Variable
  • Bit rate                                 : 2 110 b/s
  • Maximum bit rate                         : 320 kb/s / 320 kb/s
  • Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
  • Channel layout                           : L R
  • Sampling rate                            : 44.1 kHz
  • Frame rate                               : 43.066 FPS (1024 SPF)
  • Compression mode                         : Lossy
  • Stream size                              : 1.60 KiB (0%)
  • Source stream size                       : 1.61 KiB (0%)
  • Default                                  : Yes
  • Alternate group                          : 1

I also noticed the video ghosts unless I disable resample. But this does not fix the issue.

I don't know what caused this since it used to work fine. Im using the same 3d animation software to export the clips on Vegas, but for some reason this happens now. Any ideas?

Comments

Musicvid wrote on 10/31/2022, 3:22 PM

Set your project frame rate to match your source frame rate (30.000 fps).

If that doesn't help, upload your source file to Dropbox or Drive so we can look at it.

vegas13 wrote on 10/31/2022, 4:09 PM

Set your project frame rate to match your source frame rate (30.000 fps).

If that doesn't help, upload your source file to Dropbox or Drive so we can look at it.

Its already set to 30 fps. I will upload something later.

vegas13 wrote on 11/15/2022, 11:46 AM

Set your project frame rate to match your source frame rate (30.000 fps).

If that doesn't help, upload your source file to Dropbox or Drive so we can look at it.

I've upload 3 files:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/sartzj4zhxiq5aj/runtest.7z?dl=0

runtest1.mp4

runtest2.mp4

runtest1 (handbrake).mp4

On the second file I added some changes, like a camera movement and making it a bit longer, as you can see this caused change in fps:

https://i.postimg.cc/prhFJCmP/runtest1-framerate.png

https://i.postimg.cc/Mp8Q1yq8/runtest2-framerate.png

Here you can see the repeating frames, frame 2 and 3 is the same:

https://i.postimg.cc/44Vxkyr8/runtest-repeating-frame.png

I ran runtest1.mp4 throught Handbrake at the "Super HQ 1080p30 Surround" preset and it solves the repeating frames:

https://i.postimg.cc/VNNZcSv2/runtest-repeating-frame-fix.png

But it add artifacts. Notice here at the end of the clip how the stone texture changes:

https://i.postimg.cc/x8VWY0WH/runtest1-handbrake-1.png

For some reason this happens, even after trying to set lossless settings. Vegas does not do this when rendering, but the repeating frames problem stays.

The problem seems to be on the animation software since it does not render exactly at 30fps, but while this gets solved if Handbrake managed to get really lossless stuff with no artifacts at 30fps at least I would be able to work in Vegas since the clips would snap at 30fps without repeating frames. If you really zoom in on the clips, you will see there is an extra bit so stuff doesn't snap:

https://i.postimg.cc/8zWSW-6wM/runtest1clipzoom.png

To work properly the clips must be exactly 30fps.

Musicvid wrote on 11/15/2022, 1:04 PM

@vegas13

There is nothing wrong with the source file you uploaded. There are two glaring problems:

  • Vegas 13 was not made to ingest advanced AVC/x264 format. Many things have changed. Opening in VMSP 13 (the only version I have), shows one duplicate frame near the beginning.

On the second file I added some changes, like a camera movement and making it a bit longer, as you can see this caused change in fps:

  • Vegas 13 was not made to do that smoothly; you "might" be projecting year 2022 expectations onto 2014 software. Vegas 13 will drop, dupe, or blend frames since you lengthened your event -- that's it. And of course that changes the frame rate, which you did not set an even factor of 30.
  • Optical Flow Resampling, which is what I think you want, was introduced in Vegas Pro in recent versions.

If your Vegas 13 title is registered with Magix, you are entitled to an upgrade to VP20 for $79 US, but you need to jump on it because it will expire today.

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.com/us/sale/

Just for fun (I had a little time), I slowed down your clip by 33% in VP20 with Optical Slow Motion. You can see there are no dropped, duped, or blended frames. It's fun stuff.

 

 

vegas13 wrote on 11/16/2022, 2:26 PM

After more testings I have realized one thing: The previous versions of the software, rendered at exactly 30 fps:

https://i.postimg.cc/4NZ7WqWF/129.png

The new ones are not at exactly 30 fps:

https://i.postimg.cc/SKwjCvXd/pr4.png

It's clear to me what's going on: The new software is screwing up my Vegas project since every clip I render has some random amount of extra fps (30+random). The clips from the old versions are consistent at exactly 30fps. This would explain why I never had any problems before.

I thought about buying whatever newest version of Vegas there is, but I've become used to 13, it just does everything I need, and I got the Sapphire plugins, which im not sure would work on newer versions. I would probably need to learn a new GUI.

john_dennis wrote on 11/16/2022, 2:47 PM

@vegas13

As a workaround for your files with inaccurate frame rates, try using Shutter Encoder with one of the options to conform to 30 FPS.

john_dennis wrote on 11/16/2022, 2:49 PM

Also, stop sending all over Hell's Half Acre just to see your screenshots.