@pierre-k What's proxy editing about?

To be able to edit and preview (fluent) 4k footage at an editing computer with less power. For this reason proxies are just 720p24 XDCAM which can be generated very quickly even on an editing computer with less power.

What you're doing using Vegas proxies in a 1080p project, why? Just leave the project at 2160p and everything works fine. Creating a downscale render from 2160p to 1080p can always been done, also with project settings set to 2160p. For creating full framerate AVC proxies from 4k footage, you need a GPU which is able doing so, or other wise proxy creation will take an immense time. A less powerful PC normally doesn't have that GPU.

We had this possibility in VP18 for a short time, luckily it was brought back to XDCAM again.

More than a year ago, I did a lot of 4k editing on a less powerless PC (i4770 with a GTX630) and rendered also to 1080p (with Voukoder). On that PC it was not possible to create AVC proxies or to render to AVC NVENC. I had never any problem with the Vegas XDCAM proxies.

When you're looking for better quality proxies/intermediates, than Vegasaur or HOS is the solution, as already mentioned.

 What's proxy editing about?

To be able to edit and preview (fluent) 4k footage .........

The reason is clear.
I have a GPU, but overall I don't have a computer strong enough to look at a smooth 4k preview.

I don't want to watch the bitten unsightly proxy videos that are being made in Vegas while editing. The reason why this is happening is not yet known.

Everyone should be able to choose the proxy format they want.
You want Xdcam 720p. I want an AVC 1080p whose conversion is just as fast and with a much smaller size. I will not work with the size of the project during editing so that the proxy is displayed partially satisfactorily. Sorry. The 4K project affects a lot of other events and is more performance intensive.

There is no reason why I who have a GPU suffer for someone else not having a GPU.
 
To be clear ... I just want a choice.
The Xdcam format must be preserved.

@pierre-k Sorry to jump in late here, but it was good weather for a nap.

This should fix your project without requiring any guesswork (it did for me):

• 1. Match your project properties to your source using the icon (sound familiar?)
• 
• 2. Set your preview to Preview / Full (not Auto) and check this box:
• 
• 3. Save your project.
• 
• Look OK now? You can still use your proxy (sfp0) file as you wish.
• With so many fun toys, controls, and fiddly stuff now at our disposal in Vegas, it is easy to overlook the basic skills we learned in Vegas 101.

@pierre-k What's proxy editing about?

To be able to edit and preview (fluent) 4k footage .........

The reason is clear.
I have a GPU, but overall I don't have a computer strong enough to look at a smooth 4k preview.

I don't want to watch the bitten unsightly proxy videos that are being made in Vegas while editing. The reason why this is happening is not yet known.

Everyone should be able to choose the proxy format they want.
You want Xdcam 720p. I want an AVC 1080p whose conversion is just as fast and with a much smaller size. I will not work with the size of the project during editing so that the proxy is displayed partially satisfactorily. Sorry. The 4K project affects a lot of other events and is more performance intensive.

There is no reason why I who have a GPU suffer for someone else not having a GPU.
 
To be clear ... I just want a choice.
The Xdcam format must be preserved.

I'm afraid that proxy generation in Vegas will not be further improved, since there are alternatives (Vegasaur, HOS) and computers able to edit native 4k are becoming more common.

I think innovation is already happening. Today you can choose a codec for prerendering. It's a matter of time before the same proxy option comes up.

I think you're right Pierre, it's quite possible Vegas will implement better proxy options going forward as already happened with selective pre-render. We also need ones that work better with raw format video such as BlackMagic raw as it's not really playable without proxies but it looks totally wrong with the proxies.

 Sorry to jump in late here, but it was good weather for a nap.

This should fix your project without requiring any guesswork (it did for me):

• 1. Match your project properties to your source using the icon (sound familiar?)
• 
• 2. Set your preview to Preview / Full (not Auto) and check this box:
• 
• 3. Save your project.
• 
• Look OK now? You can still use your proxy (sfp0) file as you wish.

Your tutorial means that you have changed your project from 1080p to 4K and with Preview Full. This is not a solution. With such a setting, PC performance will be lacking elsewhere - Transitions, Titles, FX, etc.

But thank you for the tip.😉

Yes, as stated, I have matched my project to the source, as I have done for twenty-two years of Vegas production. That is the time-honored solution. You seem to have a divergent opinion.

With such a setting, PC performance will be lacking elsewhere - Transitions, Titles, FX, etc.

You have tested that?

Transitions, Titles, FX, Generated Media, are traditionally applied at Source (Project) Resolution, not output resolution. That is done to avoid Aspect mismatches. That is also where my timeline preview performance works best. The only exceptions I make are when using certain AI FX ( Smart Deinterlace and Upscale), which now require changing the project properties to match the output.

But suit yourself; I'm rather stuck in the pre-Magix Vegas Pro workflow, which works at its best at source properties. Best of luck, Pierre.

I almost always have about 70% 1080p files and 30% 4k files.
The output request is 1080p.
There is no reason to set the project to 4K and then render to 1080p.

Yes, I've tried it. FX and Transitions are more difficult to edit in the 4K project than in the 1080p project. The situation is even worse when the preview is in Full. And I'm not talking about dynamic memory using Shft + B.

So far, the HOS is successfully solving the situation for me. But I hope this is a temporary solution.

I would like the guys from the Vegas team to say if they are going to upgrade the internal Proxy.

Thanks a lot.

There is no reason to set the project to 4K and then render to 1080p.

Oh, there are plenty of reasons; you have experienced just one of them, actually the solution to your question.

Take note that you did not include any FHD media in your sample project. In fact, this is the first time I have heard of it.

In a mixed project such as you "now" describe, "one" option is to match the project to the output. Just don't expect a clean preview of the 4k, because it doesn't work that way 🙃

Proceed at will; if you should change your mind at some point, I'll be glad to discuss the merits and drawbacks of either approach with you. I've been at it longer. Until then, ...

@pierre-k

I have tested your project and I can reproduce your problem. Set Color Range to Full in media properties to solve this.

Unfortunately, creating Proxy files in VEGAS using Vegasaur, HOS or other external encoders is still the best option.

@pierre-k

I have tested your project and I can reproduce your problem. Set Color Range to Full in media properties to solve this.

Unfortunately, creating Proxy files in VEGAS using Vegasaur, HOS or other external encoders is still the best option.

It doesn't work for me like that. After converting the Proxy, I have all events in the Full setting immediately. Changing Full to Unedefine only changes my contrast. Not video quality.

I noticed you had something in the preview window that I didn't. Switch to original preview.

I have a VP19 b550

@pierre-k

Apparently it's another problem that is solved by activating or deactivating the GPU.

Here, with the GPU off, the preview is normal. When I activate the GPU, the same problem as yours occurred.

I confirm that disabling the GPU affects the proxy preview. But you have much better results than I do. Apparently AMD vs Nvidia. Still, the best sfvp0 file is.

Folks.. saying proxies are not as needed because of fast computers is just silly and notes some privilege some might have.

I have a pretty fast laptop , 1 year old, and can say we still don't have stellar performance editing a 9-up 4k multi-cam project. Getting 16fps is pretty darned decent all things considered, but I'm building proxies for it right now. SLOW and I expect it to not look great. Will see. I may just render and swap using Vegasaur since last time I tried building vegas-compatible proxies with HOS it didn't work out.

I see zero reason the Vegas folks would not give us a choice on what profile to use when building proxies.. what downside is there?

@Musicvid on one of your comments about transitions and fx.. I've absolutely seen Boris and Neat FX that will absolutely not behave as desired if the render or project properties change after the effect has been applied when the project a different resolution or framerate. Not all add-ons use source media resolution, even when applied before the pan/crop in the chain. (In my experience.. but not taking the time now to find specifix)

@RedRob-CandlelightProdctns

Wow...resurrecting a two year old thread? 😂

Anyway, the reason we have not yet provided a way to choose your profile for building proxies is because the current video engine architecture for the proxy pipeline has extremely limited in how it can handle GPU and color space data. We did attempt to implement the feature as you suggested, but the pipeline was so tied to a very specific format (that it can easily and efficiently decode), that when we tried to allow other formats to be used, the springs flew out of the video engine.

The team has a couple things on our wish list of items to do to improve the user experience in this area. The first is to indeed implement a new proxy pipeline in the new video engine to allow a more flexible proxy user experience (in the manner you have suggested). The second is that we hope that the work being done with the video engine will reduce (or eliminate) the need for video proxies in the future.

"...the springs flew out of the video engine."

😄 Great visual!

@VEGASDerek

@VEGASDerek oh wow. I didn't even notice how old this thread was! Someone posted a link to this thread in response to a more recent forum post.. seemed so relevant that I just figured it was a current discussion.

Oops!

Glad to hear there's headway on the topic and improving the user experience editing increasingly large formats.. especially affects me with our Multicam use... it isn't just one 4k being decoded and previewed.. it's 7 or 8 or 9 concurrently.

TBH, I'm always super impressed how well Vegas DOES handle it already!