Renderproblem

j-v wrote on 1/13/2019, 10:59 AM

I have a big renderproblem with all the Vegas Pro 16 builds I have (261,307, 352) with a ( less than 1 minute) smal project, holding a lot of jpg timelapse stills from my GOPro 5(4000x3000 pixels) and a few GPro 5 2,7K videofiles. The stills are first rendered to a lossless Sony YUV avi video file and after that entered into the project with the other videofiles.

Then all files speeded up max with Ctrl-Drag and after that added a velocity envelope to the files and set all at +100%.
Rendering freezes between frame 600 and 800, tried it 12 times in the different builds with and without so4-compoundplug.
After about frame 550 the render slowed down till it freezes Vegas.
Rendering in VPro 15 latest build without a problem and much faster.

I did send an error message of the latest freeze.

See the video here: https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/post-your-vegas-creations--109464/?page=6#ca708038

Last changed by j-v

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

Comments

Kinvermark wrote on 1/13/2019, 12:05 PM

Well, as you know... post your project details, render settings, etc. :)

But in the meanwhile you could try:

1) import jpeg timelapse as an image sequence - don't bother with intermediate Sony YUV render.

2) Try rendering out to a different format. Perhaps an intermediate like MagicYUV (it's lossless so you can re-render without problems.)

 

 

Grazie wrote on 1/13/2019, 12:26 PM

@Kinvermark Totally!

j-v wrote on 1/13/2019, 1:31 PM

Well, as you know... post your project details, render settings, etc. :)

Nothing special

But in the meanwhile you could try:

1) import jpeg timelapse as an image sequence - don't bother with intermediate Sony YUV render.

Not possible
Look

2) Try rendering out to a different format. Perhaps an intermediate like MagicYUV (it's lossless so you can re-render without problems.)\

I did, all went wrong rendering frozen between about 550 and 700 th frame.
Nothing wrong with that frame cause it's in the middle of a videofile from which the beginning is rendering well and than suddenly slows down a lot, while in VPro 15 all renders normal. I copied all the files from VPro 16 to 15, both were open.

I think, reading your answer you know what I did wrong, so I,m very curious about that fault of me ( and VPro 15??????)

Last changed by j-v on 1/13/2019, 1:34 PM, changed a total of 1 times.

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

Kinvermark wrote on 1/13/2019, 1:40 PM

Not possible

Checkmark the "open sequence" box?

I don't have the idea that you did "something wrong" just some suggestions for working around the issue.

I would turn off smart resample and NVENC.

j-v wrote on 1/13/2019, 2:40 PM

Checkmark the "open sequence" box?

As you can see on the video it is greyed out if I select all the jpegs.
If I select the first one than as normal are all the files with following numbers in the "open sequence box", here not, the GOPro numbers get after a certain amount a number in the middle of the zero's.
Therefor you have to choose everytime when a new row starts the first one for the next sequence. I did that first, but after 6 of those sequence files I stopped because I had to do it another 20 times.
Then it is quicker to rename all the files on that location in Windows ( from the same timelapse) to a new name but Windows gave them a following number and that one does Vegas not accept for a sequence when I tried to do. So it was much easier to enter those pictures in Vegas with a duration of 1 projectframe (1/50 with me) and render them out to a lossless avi file, a 1 minute job.

Last changed by j-v on 1/15/2019, 6:46 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

3POINT wrote on 1/13/2019, 3:36 PM

Better use next time the timelapse Videomode of your GoPro instead of the timelapse Photomode. You will get directly a timelapse video from your GoPro instead of a bunch photos.

j-v wrote on 1/13/2019, 4:01 PM

I have an update.
Did some more tests, also on Vegas I can't show here, but also VMSPL 15 did render the whole project, projecfiles copied and the same rendersettings used in a short time to the desired exportfile.
I also could track the problems in V16 down to the last 4 files in that project, so to show the problem fast enough I cutted the beginning away and tried to render first that part with Pro 16 and copied it after it froze after more than 6 minutes "rendertime" to VMS 15 where it rendered in 1 minute and 40 seconds.
I'll show those renders, also for the team when they are maybe looking after that reported error.
I could not find any reason why VPro 16 would not render and the others did, unless maybe a kind of memorybug?

I stop searching by now.

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

Kinvermark wrote on 1/13/2019, 4:05 PM

@3POINT

Problem with that is the pixel dimensions will be reduced, so if you want to pan/scan/zoom...

 

I am curious if this method of importing a "bunch" of stills as single frames as opposed to a sequence of stills is the root cause. In theory it should work, but perhaps Vegas 16 has a "hiccup." If you are still interested ( I would probably just give up and use 15 for this job) you could try renaming in Adobe bridge or "Bulk Rename Utility" - recommended by Nick Hope.

j-v wrote on 1/13/2019, 4:11 PM

Better use next time the timelapse Videomode of your GoPro instead of the timelapse Photomode. You will get directly a timelapse video from your GoPro instead of a bunch photos.

Yess Theo, I knew that and did it before, but I'm on vacation right now and I had this morning to be early and could not connect my smartphone app with the GoPro that stood already outside, so I fumbled around with my bad eyes in the dark on that litle GOPro screen I could hardly see, but I saw that it took pictures every 10 sec. so I fled inside again.😉😙

 

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

Musicvid wrote on 1/13/2019, 9:01 PM

You might want to try out some of the newer Intermediates, as well. Yes, I previously used Sony YUV for everything.

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/uncompressed-vs-sony-yuv-vs-magic-yuv-the-shootout--113650/

 

3POINT wrote on 1/13/2019, 11:48 PM

@3POINT

Problem with that is the pixel dimensions will be reduced, so if you want to pan/scan/zoom...

The photo has the same Pixel dimensions as the video when 16:9 at is needed. You just use the photo mode for timelapse when you need long exposure times, like timelapses of night skies.

3POINT wrote on 1/14/2019, 2:34 AM

 but I saw that it took pictures every 10 sec. so I fled inside again.😉😙

 

For a sunrise/sunset timelapse, I would go for an interval of 1 or 2 sec. You get than 60 or 30 frames per minute. A sunrise/sunset takes about one hour, means 3600 frames or 1800 frames. Importing that timelapse video at projects framerate of your favorite framerate of 50 fps, the timelapse will just be 72 sec or 36 seconds long. No speeding or timestretching necessary in Vegas.

j-v wrote on 1/14/2019, 3:12 AM

For a sunrise/sunset timelapse, I would go for an interval of 1 or 2 sec. You get than 60 or 30 frames per minute. A sunrise/sunset takes about one hour, means 3600 frames or 1800 frames. Importing that timelapse video at projects framerate of your favorite framerate of 50 fps, the timelapse will just be 72 sec or 36 seconds long. No speeding or timestretching necessary in Vegas.

Thanks Theo.
I think I try that tomorrow, it's sure the coming days we have here very clear weather and I'm going to try it again.
I now also installed everything back io my new smartphone Galaxy A8 and renewed the GOPro app and I can manage the GOPro again with that app.

@Musicvid

The problem has nothing to do with the pictures and the intermediate I made.
They give no problem to re-encode with my used template.
I could track the problem down for the use of 4 "normal" 2,7 GoPro video files and speeding them up(I think)
I made for the Vegas team a new Problem veg with those files and I'm going to upload them to my dropbox, but where I am at the moment that uploading takes a very long time.

Last changed by j-v on 1/14/2019, 7:37 AM, changed a total of 1 times.

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

Musicvid wrote on 1/14/2019, 9:38 AM

It was offered as a sidebar, not a solution. Thats why I used the words "as well," conveying "in addition to. "

Sony YUV is monstrous and inneficient by today's standards. That's my comment.

Kinvermark wrote on 1/14/2019, 10:39 AM

@3POINT

The photo has the same Pixel dimensions as the video when 16:9 at is needed. You just use the photo mode for timelapse when you need long exposure times, like timelapses of night skies.

 

Say what? :)

I don't have a Gopro Hero 5, but JV said the stills were 4000 x 3000 pixels so that gives quite a lot of vertical overlap past the dimensions of UHD (3840 x 2160) and even more over 2.7K video. You don't need to scale the image, just crop in and pan/scan/zoom around as you want.

In general (maybe not for gopro) , stills are far preferable to video for timelapse as you have better control over exposure (1/2 second shutter gives really nice smooth results) and of course the in-camera image processing is better.

 

3POINT wrote on 1/14/2019, 1:50 PM

When I combine a 4:3 picture with a 16: 9 video with almost the same horizontal resolution, I can only tilt the picture vertically but there is no room for panning or zooming. I don't understand what you mean by scanning.

Kinvermark wrote on 1/14/2019, 2:58 PM

I don't understand what you mean by scanning.

It's an old term for the same thing we are talking about - fitting a 4:3 image into a widscreen format.

Agreed, you do not end up with a lot of extra pixels for zooming & horizontal panning in a UHD timeline, but I think enough to make a nice improvement in the dynamics of the shot. Obviously on a 2.7k or HD timeline you would have a lot more latitude.

j-v wrote on 1/14/2019, 3:18 PM

I only use HD export for my own use, so mostly I use also a FHD 50p project.
Only when special exporting for Facebook or Smartphones ( whats ap) I downgrade it in export by using the Magix AVC Internet HD 720 25fps NVENC template with a good and much lower filessize.
Only Slideshows I make with UHD or max 4 K exportsettings, but watching on my TV from signature I don't see the difference by the settings I choose there.

BTW
I think my uploads for joining a problem veg from the OP and included a screenplay of the fault will be available tomorrow, due to my slow upload possibilities at the moment.
I'll be back then.

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

j-v wrote on 1/15/2019, 3:27 AM

I give here the link to my dropbox with my Problemveg for Vegas Pro 16, that everytime gives near the end a freeze after too long rendering of the frames.
It renders fine when I do the same in VPro 15 or VMS Pl 15, to see on these screenshots

 

I hope someone can deny or confirm this behaviour on VPro 16>
Here is the link to my dropbox with the source, the veg and a screenplay of the rendering in my VPro16:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/acs5e27vvoznw0s/Renderproblem.zip?dl=0

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

j-v wrote on 1/17/2019, 9:02 AM

This renderproblem is solved in the newest build.
Still a very long rendertime of 7min 28 sec for little more than 13 sec of video project compared to the real solution we found with the help of @3POINT and @Kinvermark . There it renders in 2min 54 sec without freezing
What was it?
Due to my switches of the different Vegas 16 builds, made trying to help another member, I forgot to switch back the project resample mode to my most used "Disable Resample" . So in the problem veg it was the default Smart Resample, that slowed the render much down till it somewhere froze with the error message.

My thanks go to 3POINT and Kinvermark for pushing in the right direction.

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)

 

3POINT wrote on 1/17/2019, 1:36 PM

I understood that your next try of a sunrise timelapse in the timelapse Videomode got a quicker result.

j-v wrote on 1/17/2019, 2:10 PM

Much quicker and better as I showed also on the Dutch forum.
It was this one, a small 720HD render for sending to my frends over WhatsApp to show on their smartphones

met vriendelijke groet
Marten

Camera : Pan X900, GoPro Hero7 Hero Black, DJI Osmo Pocket, Samsung Galaxy A8
Desktop :MB Gigabyte Z390M, W11 home version 24H2, i7 9700 4.7Ghz,16 DDR4 GB RAM, Gef. GTX 1660 Ti with driver
566.14 Studiodriver and Intel HD graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Laptop  :Asus ROG Str G712L, W11 home version 23H2, CPU i7-10875H, 16 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 with Studiodriver 566.14 and Intel UHD Graphics 630 with driver 31.0.101.2130
Vegas software: VP 10 to 21 and VMS(pl) 10,12 to 17.
TV      :LG 4K 55EG960V

My slogan is: BE OR BECOME A STEM CELL DONOR!!! (because it saved my life in 2016)