VP16 : Glitchy render (and also very slow)

NourritureNoire wrote on 1/24/2019, 5:43 PM

Hello,

My 7970 died few month ago so I decided to go for a rx 570 and upgrade from VP13 to VP16.

Everything worked great for the first days... but during a project I asked for a pre-render (alt+M) on a blur effect and everything went glitchy as this video shows.

Then the glitches and artefacts spread everywhere (in preview, in pre-render and in render).I don’t remember changing any parameters or options. When I closed vegas and reopened it just after the apparition of the glitches, he told me that there were an error during the opening of all my media files

https://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2019/04/5/1548372406-50958860-344970203011840-7384022111607586816-n.png

I re-linked them all and the glitches were still here.

Note that rendering time is really high, just now it took 30 minutes to render my complete project (4 min of 1080p 30fps, moderately edited :some zoom, color correction, shake etc)

The only way to get glitches and artefacts off is to disable GPU acceleration.

As my card is brand new, I still have some days to get a refund and buy another card. But I assume this can be solved, what do you think ?

Important info : W7 family 64bits build 7601 - I7 3770K – 16 Go RAM DDR3 – MSI RX570 8 Go

It happens with all my video source (Honor 8, Gopro 4black, Gopro 3 silver) and for every rendering options (.wmv, HVEC, MXF etc)

I tried other AMD Drivers : 18.9.1, 18.12.2, 19.1.1 didn't work

I tried some VEGAS build : 307, 361, 352 didn't work

I tried with VP13, instant crash when opening a project with GPU acceleration with my rx 570

I tried to reset Vegas with CTRL SHIFT while opening didn't change anything

And i repeat that everything was working great before i pre-rendered something. I don't really understand how is it possible but it happened like that.

Thanks for reading my post and thanks in advance for your help.

Comments

Musicvid wrote on 1/24/2019, 6:50 PM

You didn't say what you were using as your prerender encoder.

You did say it works with gpu off.

Those are big clues

Start here and let us know what you come up with.

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/vegas-pro-faqs-and-troubleshooting-guides--104787/

john_dennis wrote on 1/24/2019, 8:30 PM

"Important info : W7 family 64bits build 7601 - I7 3770K – 16 Go RAM DDR3 – MSI RX570 8 Go"

There is a video adapter on the die of the i7 3770K. Is it being used for anything? Does it have a driver loaded, a display attached?

NourritureNoire wrote on 1/25/2019, 4:31 PM

Thank you for your reply, Musicvid.

If I got it right, the .mp4/.wmv/etc are the containers of the video data and "Sony MXF HD ES 1920-1080, MPEG HD" would be the encoder ? If that's true then I used the one quoted. But i tried others like Mainconcept MPEG-2 YUV, WMV with a normal render, glitches are still here

(my final format would be .wmv 1080p,)

I've tried using the guide before posting (21. Why does my rendered video look bad? and 18. Graphics Cards & GPU-Acceleration for VEGAS Pro) but except for the "disable GPU acceleration", nothing worked

I guess it's not common to have a very recent card with very recents drivers, do you think it's why there is such problems ?

NourritureNoire wrote on 1/25/2019, 4:32 PM

Thank you for your reply, john_dennis.
Ehm... I don't think i use it. But i can't select it in GPU acceleration. Is it because i should plug my HDMI on the motherboard instead of the graphic card ?
But I guess you're saying that for a reason : Do you think I could use the HD 4000 for the GPu acceleration with good results ?

And unfortunately i only have one screen (that should change soon)

j-v wrote on 1/25/2019, 5:18 PM

"Sony MXF HD ES 1920-1080, MPEG HD" would be the encoder ?

No, the codec is a very old one, the Main Concept Mpeg2 encoder.
For the same you must choose in Vegas that codec with the right settings

For your export you have to choose the Windows Media Video codec for your needs maybe with customized settings

Sorry at this moment it is for me not possible to upload screenhots of the codecs to use due to "upload error"

Musicvid wrote on 1/25/2019, 6:24 PM

No, the codec is a very old one, the Main Concept Mpeg2 encoder.
For the same you must choose in Vegas that codec with the right settings

For your export you have to choose the Windows Media Video codec for your needs maybe with customized settings

j-v

I think you're stretching.

Mpeg-2, even at high resolution or all-intra, is the most efficient prerender codec in Vegas, and I tested a bunch of 'em. That said, I would be sure to choose a progressive prerender with progressive source.

TBQH I use HDV 720p for almost all prerenders, even full HD projects. It's light weight, a fast upload to a media server, and quite good quality for a quick evaluation print or screen cast.

Let's see, no b-frames, short closed GOP, reasonable compression, low cpu load, yeah that's the one. I don't know why this has changed suddenly after 15 years, but WMV? Really???

Plausibility is certainly something worth considering when advising new users.

NourritureNoire wrote on 1/25/2019, 6:25 PM

Well to be totally honest... because i suck when it comes to rendering/codec/encoder and all those things. I've been using Vegas for 6 years with the folowing habit "let's press this button and see what happens".

So now i'm here, knowing how to edit but not to render.

At least if don't get those things off, I would have learned that I need to work on the rendering part !

PS : i'll go with the Mpeg-2, i trust your 6 green quarters near your profil pic !

Musicvid wrote on 1/25/2019, 6:54 PM

I still don't know what's the matter, but its not the software codec, merely a clue to some hardware stuff you've got going. I hoped that would seem obvious by now. But never fear, john_dennis is here to help with that, possibly a driver, possibly something else, but probably not so4.

Until then, I suggest you run with GPU turned off. We did fine with just our naked CPUs for a couple of decades.

j-v wrote on 1/26/2019, 4:08 AM

No, the codec is a very old one, the Main Concept Mpeg2 encoder.
For the same you must choose in Vegas that codec with the right settings

For your export you have to choose the Windows Media Video codec for your needs maybe with customized settings

j-v

I think you're stretching.

Mpeg-2, even at high resolution or all-intra, is the most efficient prerender codec in Vegas, and I tested a bunch of 'em. That said, I would be sure to choose a progressive prerender with progressive source.

TBQH I use HDV 720p for almost all prerenders, even full HD projects. It's light weight, a fast upload to a media server, and quite good quality for a quick evaluation print or screen cast.

Let's see, no b-frames, short closed GOP, reasonable compression, low cpu load, yeah that's the one. I don't know why this has changed suddenly after 15 years, but WMV? Really???

Plausibility is certainly something worth considering when advising new users.

@Musicvid

Sorry for that mistake, but I was not advising anything.
I tried to give answer on 2 questions the OP made.
First if Sony MXF HD ES 1920-1080, MPEG HD was his used codec and second where he could find the codec to use for his "final format"

But I think you are able to point out for me where to find the Sony MXF HD ES 1920-1080, MPEG HD codec in the list of VPro 15 or 16. Thanks in advance.

Musicvid wrote on 1/26/2019, 8:51 AM

Really, I think we both may havehmissed the point of the first post.

I have Sony MXF HD "EX" 1920-1080, MPEG HD

on VP14, and it looks like a reasonable, safe choice as a prerender.

Beyond that, I can't explain the OPs choices other than in his own words, and he is quite inexperienced, but reasonable and open to new thoughts. That in itself is a big plus+

I know when I'm "jumping in" to a discussion by the number of times I get caught misinterpreting the substance or intent of the OP.

New users like NourritureNoire are wide open to advice and don't yet have good mental filters to be able to "separate the wheat from the chaff" [slang] in a public forum.

I think there is a hardware or driver issue at play. Maybe even a connector or internal setting. He's got a lot of equipment interfaced.

The reason I think it may be a hardware or driver issue is because the problem goes away with gpu acceleration off, and he reports rendering to a stable legacy codec. Hmm.....

Nick or one of the other real gurus may have a different interpretation. The role of so4, if any, would be in his source properties, which I don't see, and should have requested:

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/faq-how-to-post-mediainfo-and-vegas-pro-file-properties--104561/

Guess I'll spend more time off the keyboard myself.

Musicvid wrote on 1/26/2019, 9:02 AM

I would suggest an AVC Internet template as the output. It's deliverable.

NourritureNoire wrote on 1/26/2019, 4:01 PM

Update and partial solution : i rollbacked to the oldest AMD driver i could find, 18.6.1 from june 2018 and glitches are gone (tried 3 renders, some pre-renders and some effects on preview) but this drivers created conflict with some application (mostly games) that crashes at launch (fortnite) or have lower performance.

I mentioned partial solution because my GPU was supposed to be used for Vegas + gaming, so not the best answer to this problem.

Here is the media info

General
Complete name : E:\Vidéo\Soirée triée\18 - Soirée nouvel an 2018 julie\GOPR6751.MP4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 1
Codec ID : mp41 (mp41)
File size : 330 MiB
Duration : 1 min 31 s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 30.1 Mb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03
Tagged date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03
AMBA : x

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings : CABAC / 1 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, RefFrames : 1 frame
Format settings, GOP : M=1, N=15
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 1 min 31 s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 30.0 Mb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 29.970 (30000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.483
Stream size : 329 MiB (100%)
Title : GoPro AVC
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03
Tagged date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03
Color range : Full
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Codec configuration box : avcC

Audio
ID : 2
Format : AAC LC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec Low Complexity
Codec ID : mp4a-40-2
Duration : 1 min 31 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 128 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel layout : L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 46.875 FPS (1024 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 1.40 MiB (0%)
Title : GoPro AAC
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03
Tagged date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03

Other #1
ID : 3
Type : Time code
Format : QuickTime TC
Duration : 1 min 31 s
Title : GoPro TCD
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03
Tagged date : UTC 2015-01-30 06:59:03

Other #2
Type : Time code
Time code of first frame : 06:58:48:17
Time code, striped : Yes
Bit rate mode : VBR

Musicvid wrote on 1/26/2019, 4:15 PM

Now the Vegas file properties please.

We need to know the particular decoder Vegas used.

NourritureNoire wrote on 1/26/2019, 4:39 PM

Ok, Vegas file properties :

General
Name: GOPR6751.MP4
Folder: E:\Vidéo\Soirée triée\18 - Soirée nouvel an 2018 julie
Type: AVC
Size: 338,08 MB (346 197 727 bytes)
Created: lundi 1 janvier 2018, 20:31:50
Modified: lundi 1 janvier 2018, 20:32:14
Accessed: samedi 13 janvier 2018, 19:53:43
Attributes: Archive

Streams
Video: 00:01:31,925, 29,970 fps progressive, 1920x1080x12, AVC
Audio: 00:01:31,925, 48 000 Hz; Stereo, AAC

Summary
[TCFM]: 249108103174

ACID information
ACID chunk: no
Stretch chunk: no
Stretch list: no
Stretch info2: no
Beat markers: no
Detected beats: no

Other metadata
Regions/markers: no
Command markers: no

Media manager
Media tags: no

Plug-In
Name: compoundplug.dll
Folder: C:\Program Files\VEGAS\VEGAS Pro 16.0\FileIO Plug-Ins\compoundplug
Format: AVC
Version: Version 16.0 (Build 361)
Company: MAGIX Computer Products Intl. Co.

Musicvid wrote on 1/26/2019, 7:30 PM

Did you previously disable so4compoundplug, or is this the original configuration?

NourritureNoire wrote on 1/27/2019, 5:33 AM

It was the ogirinal one but i tried disabling so4compoundplug.dll in the internal preference tab, it didn't change anything (i noticed a little less fps in the preview)

Musicvid wrote on 1/27/2019, 1:00 PM

Well, we've tried something that doesn't work. I'm told there is some intrinsic value in that 😃

Since you are plugging HDMI directly to your board, rule out those components and settings first.

.dll conflicts between editing and games are not unknown here. A scratch build on a dedicated editing box may turn out to be a solution.

Good luck!

OldSmoke wrote on 1/27/2019, 5:47 PM

@NourritureNoire In case it wasn't suggested yet, try and set your render threads under preferences to 1 and render a section that gives you troubles.