Not getting a sharp picture in a sports video

Steve Grisetti wrote on 4/4/2016, 7:31 AM

Is your project set up for 1920x1080 and 50 fps?

musicvid10 wrote on 4/4/2016, 8:48 AM

"

PAL presets are not 50p, they are 25 fps, meaning 50i.
You are getting blurring caused by frame interpolation and subsequent resampling to 25fps.
Match your media properties exactly in the project and render.
You do this by clicking the "Match Media Settings" icon on the upper RH corner of the Project Properties window,.

That said, Youtube's processing is horrible. Don't set your hopes too high.

TDK6 wrote on 4/4/2016, 1:18 PM

Thanks for your input both of you. My project parameters are as follows:

Template: Custom (1920x1080; 50,000 fps)
Width: 1920
Height:1080
Field order: None (progressive scan)
Frame rate: 50,000 (Double PAL)
Stereoscopic 3D mode: Off
Full resolution rendering quality: Good
Deinterlace method: Blend fields
Adjust source media to better match project or render settings: Checked

I changed the deinterlace method to "Interpolate fields" but did not seem to make any big difference. BTW, when I look at the video in the preview window as it renders I see the double frame defect effect. Not when I look at the preview window as a normal playback. Any clue?

Former user wrote on 4/4/2016, 1:20 PM

What format are you rendering to? That is where the frame issue would come up.

musicvid10 wrote on 4/4/2016, 1:33 PM

OK again, set your Project Properties and Render Properties precisely the same as your source.
Youtube accepts 1080 p50 just fine.

With your Project correctly set as Proigressive, the deinterlace method is irrelevant and nonfunctional.
Second-guessing the controls will not have a positive effect.

Set your Preview at Best/Full leaving "Adjust Source Media" unchecked.
Your Project and Preview Properties will affect your Preview!

Your Render Properties will affect your finished video.

Really, that's all there is to it.
Don't change stuff without having a specific reason, and check here first. Those controls are everything!

If you still have issues, post your complete MediaInfo Properties for both Source and Rendered video.
MediaInfo is a free download from SourceForge. But watch to opt out of additional software at install.
We won't be able to help further without seeing them.

TDK6 wrote on 4/4/2016, 3:05 PM

DonaldT, Im rendering to mp4 at the moment for maximum quality.

Former user wrote on 4/4/2016, 3:14 PM

Thanks, but need a bit more than that like Musicvid said. Need framerate, resolution, interlaced/progressive, etc

TDK6 wrote on 4/4/2016, 3:24 PM

Where do I set my project to Progressive? I have matched the media video settings by pressing the last of the 3 buttons after selecting Template in Project Properties. The template shows a "Custom (1920x1080; 50,000 fps).

Where are the preview settings you are talking about? Could not find any such check box.

When I render I just check the MP4 box and press render. I do not fiddle with any settings at that stage.

musicvid10 wrote on 4/4/2016, 3:50 PM

The Preview settings are on top of the Preview Pane.

The interactive tutorials that came with your program will be a big help, along with several good ones on Youtube. Steve Grisetti has training books available at a reasonable cost on Amazon.

TDK6 wrote on 4/4/2016, 3:56 PM

I downloaded the MediaInfo software. Maybe it can be of some help. The source is the original file filmed with the camcorder and the render is an MP4.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Source:

General
ID : 1 (0x1)
Complete name : C:\Users\TDK\Documents\Movie Studio Platinum 13.0 Projects\20160403 Ace of Air 2016\Stream\00019.MTS
CompleteName_Last : C:\Users\TDK\Documents\Movie Studio Platinum 13.0 Projects\20160403 Ace of Air 2016\Stream\00117.MTS
Format : BDAV
Format/Info : Blu-ray Video
File size : 4.17 GiB
Duration : 12s 462ms
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 2 877 Mbps
Maximum Overall bit rate : 28.0 Mbps

Video
ID : 4113 (0x1011)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.2
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Format settings, GOP : M=3, N=24
Codec ID : 27
Duration : 12s 441ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 2 763 Mbps
Maximum bit rate : 26.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 50.000 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 26.648
Stream size : 4.00 GiB (96%)

Audio
ID : 4352 (0x1100)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Mode extension : CM (complete main)
Format settings, Endianness : Big
Codec ID : 129
Duration : 12s 513ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 384 Kbps
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Compression mode : Lossy
Delay relative to video : -40ms
Stream size : 587 KiB (0%)

Text
ID : 4608 (0x1200)
Menu ID : 1 (0x1)
Format : PGS
Codec ID : 144
Duration : 11s 936ms
Delay relative to video : -40ms

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Render:

General
Complete name : C:\Users\TDK\Documents\Movie Studio Platinum 13.0 Projects\Swinghill Ace of Air 2016 Rookie and Pro Test 003 mp4.mp4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID : mp42
File size : 19.4 MiB
Duration : 9s 720ms
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 16.7 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2016-04-04 09:33:13
Tagged date : UTC 2016-04-04 09:33:13

Video
ID : 2
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : Baseline@L4
Format settings, CABAC : No
Format settings, ReFrames : 3 frames
Format settings, GOP : M=1, N=15
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 9s 720ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 16.6 Mbps
Maximum bit rate : 18.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Standard : NTSC
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.319
Stream size : 19.2 MiB (99%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2016-04-04 09:33:13
Tagged date : UTC 2016-04-04 09:33:13
Color range : Limited

Audio
ID : 1
Format : AAC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
Format profile : LC
Codec ID : 40
Duration : 9s 664ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 192 Kbps
Channel(s) : channel0
Channel(s)_Original : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 227 KiB (1%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2016-04-04 09:33:13
Tagged date : UTC 2016-04-04 09:33:13

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vkmast wrote on 4/4/2016, 4:11 PM

Note that you can get "context-sensitive" help if you hover over the buttons with your mouse and watch out for Help texts.

You are able to select (and customize) a specific render template only if you go to Advanced Options.

musicvid10 wrote on 4/4/2016, 4:12 PM

OK, Here's what you need to do.

In the Custom Render dialog, set the frame rate exactly at 50.000, as has been suggested a few times in this thread.

Project->Make Movie->Save to Hard Disk (not Upload!)->Advanced Options->Mainconcept AVC->Internet 1080p->Customize->Frame Rate->[type in] 50.000

Then you can save your custom preset for future use. The tutorials will tell you how.,

That's it. I promise!

vkmast wrote on 4/4/2016, 4:33 PM

The good Doctor Zen has a somewhat longer tutorial on his excellent site to confirm the above.

musicvid10 wrote on 4/4/2016, 4:36 PM

Very thorough tutorial, btw. I hope Sony updates their presets soon to reflect current YT HD params.

TDK6 wrote on 4/5/2016, 6:23 AM

Thanks for all your input here everybody.

musicvid10, thanks for the instructions but I had a hard time typing 50,000 in there. However, I managed it somehow but for some reason the double frames show up anyway. The only way I was able to improve on that was to cut the frame rate to 25,000 but then the video became much more hacking than before. You cannot compare it to the sharp and smooth original media.

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Here is the 50,000 fps version:

Video
ID : 2
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : Main@L4.2
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 3 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 9s 700ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 15.8 Mbps
Maximum bit rate : 24.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 50.000 fps
Standard : NTSC
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.152
Stream size : 18.2 MiB (99%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2016-04-05 06:45:23
Tagged date : UTC 2016-04-05 06:45:23
Color range : Limited

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Here is the 25,000 fps PAL version:

Video
ID : 2
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : Main@L4
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 3 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 9s 760ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 16.8 Mbps
Maximum bit rate : 24.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 12.500 fps
Standard : NTSC
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.647
Stream size : 19.5 MiB (99%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2016-04-05 07:04:12
Tagged date : UTC 2016-04-05 07:04:12
Color range : Limited

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EricLNZ wrote on 4/5/2016, 7:19 AM

Are you slowing down the video on the timeline?

musicvid10 wrote on 4/5/2016, 9:08 AM

If the first video is jumpy and there is nothing else is screwed up on the timeline, it is a playback issue.
These are very common.
And no, the second one is not 25 fps, it is half.

musicvid10 wrote on 4/5/2016, 9:20 AM

Eric makes a good point. If you changed the playback rate or stretched the video, the frame rate is NOT 50fps. It could be anything. Stretching must be done in exact multiples of 2 with resampling turned OFF in order to play smoothly on a capable system.

There are many excellent tutorials for doing so, and that is where you would need to start. Really no need to re-invent the wheel here.
Best of luck.

TDK6 wrote on 4/5/2016, 2:18 PM

EricLNZ, yes, I'm slowing the video down. Where the music starts.

TDK6 wrote on 4/5/2016, 3:06 PM

musicvid10, thanks for pointing that out to me. It was half PAL. But here is now a new one that looks ok to me:

Video
ID : 2
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : Main@L4
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 3 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 5s 880ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 16.8 Mbps
Maximum bit rate : 24.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Standard : NTSC
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.324
Stream size : 11.8 MiB (99%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2016-04-05 19:26:39
Tagged date : UTC 2016-04-05 19:26:39
Color range : Limited

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It is 25,000 fps. If I render it to 50,000 fps then I get that overlapping effect again. I did another change as well. The slowmotion was set to 0,250. I changed it to 0,5. Now it looks ok. And the frame rate is PAL 25;000 fps. Still, the quality of the render and the original media is quite big. BTW, why does it say that its NTSC when it should be PAL?

TDK6 wrote on 4/5/2016, 3:09 PM

musicvid10, could not find the resampling parameter. Where is it? As I mentioned before, I have not been very accurate with the playback rate. So is it ok if the media is 50 and I slow down by half and render at 25? Im not very good at this Im sorry.

EricLNZ wrote on 4/5/2016, 6:05 PM

TDK6 - resampling is in an Events Properties or right click on an Event on the timeline, select Switches and then Disable Resampling.

When you slow a clip down extra frames have to be created and with sampling these can cause ghosting as they are like crossfades. Disabling resampling avoids this but as frames are instead duplicated any movement can look jerky.

In your case as you are shooting at 50fps and slowing down to 50% and exporting at 25fps SMS shouldn't have to create frames as it has the frames it needs without having to create them. At least that's my theory.

Lastly I trust you are comparing your export to your source material by looking at your exported mp4 files on your PC, not YouTube. YT will have reprocessed your videos.

musicvid10 wrote on 4/5/2016, 6:20 PM

"
Ok you changed the playback rate of the source from 50p to "something else."
Looking forward, that is the kind of thing we would need to know first.

The following mini-tutorial was posted here five years ago.
The correct search terms on the forums are "slomo" or "slow motion."
The kind of results you want are easy to obtain, but the math must be exactly right.
Need to walk before you can run.

60p to 30p Slow Motion

TDK6 wrote on 4/7/2016, 4:20 PM

Thanks all of you. I suddenly started to get blurry double frames on my normal speed clips. That was all fixed when the I enabled Disable Resample DIR. So now I'm:

- in the project window I match the video settings to the media which is 50,000 (Double PAL) and I set the render to Best
- on the media in the timeline I enable DIR
- when I render I choose: advanced options/main concept AVC/Internet HD 1080p/customize template/Frame rate 25,000 (PAL)

:)