Blu ray discs freeze towards end of long play discs

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/13/2019, 1:28 AM

I have freeze problem with Blu Ray disc in VMS13 ( same in VMS16). Video is of theatre show in 2 Acts. First is 90 mins second is 45 mins. For past shows of similar length , have made both DVD and Blu Ray versions, one disc for each Act. Never had this problem. I have 23 scene selects in Act 1 and about 16 in Act 2 ( Scenes associated with each song start) . DVD discs play without issue, but Blu Ray freeze at about scene 22. After many tries, I split the whole show into equal length sections each just over an hour. Again find the (Act 1 pt 2 plus Act 2) disc freezes just after about 22. Tried one without scene selection ( rendered in VMS13 and sent to DVD architect to make a Blu Ray) and it too freezes about same place. The file sizes are only about 16 -18 GB well within a single layer Blu Ray disc capacity. As I say, done these shows this way for 4 years and this is first time. Can anyone suggest how to overcome this? The discs have the freeze issue on different brand Blu Ray players but not in PC.


Steve Grisetti wrote on 9/13/2019, 7:02 AM

You say that the discs do no freeze when played on your computer. That seems to indicate that the issue is with the disc player itself. Have you tried playing this disc on someone else's BluRay player?

Do you have this issue when record a BluRay that is under 80 minutes in length? It could be things are jamming up when the player is moving from layer 1 to layer 2 of your disc, a common trouble spot. Are you using a dual-layer disc?

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/13/2019, 7:20 AM

The problem occurs on other people's Blu ray players.. I just happened to glance at my set of blank Blu Rays and I had previously focused on teh 25GB capacity,, but note beside it " 130min recordable" That is certainly a and possibly the cause of my problems as the ACT 1 is 135 min long and it stops about 5 mins from the end!!! I am using single layer discs.. so need to investigate various blank options to see if I can overcome it with different blanks.

Former user wrote on 9/13/2019, 10:47 AM

I didn't think there was a time limit on disks, more of a data limit. Might need to investigate a bit more.

vkmast wrote on 9/13/2019, 12:44 PM

"File size is determined by bitrate and duration. If you want it smaller without making it shorter then use a lower bitrate. Note, however, that while you can reduce the bitrate to potentially get as tiny a file as desired, the lower the bitrate the worse the quality will be." (e.g. Chienworks, 2015)

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/13/2019, 10:22 PM

Thanks Dot and vkmast.. I got a bit confused about the length of play.. it is about 130 mins and mine is only 95 mins so that isn't issue. I realize I can reduce bit rate but want highest quality if possible. I am still confused as to why a program of only 16-19 GB has these problems on a disc with capacity 25GB. Maybe quality of Blanks?? Unlikely these days. As I run into freeze with various cut down versions, e.g end of Act 1 with All Act 2 I feel there is a fundamental issue which I would like to understand and overcome.. Will keep trying things.

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/16/2019, 8:42 PM

I have tried several ways to try and discover why the disc freezes. I completely re-rendered the file, sent it to DVD architect, made iso and then burnt at VERY slow speed so as to be sure it was not a burning issue. The whole processes took about 24 hours !!! Obscene time. Again whether playing on stand alone Panasonic Blu Ray player or in my PC player, the freeze occurs about the same time 1h 23 mins. Completely out of ideas. I did at last get a reply from Magix support today, so have sent off a replay with info they requested about system etc, and am hoping they can identify what is happening with Freezing, Copyright issue and another issue I have with VMS 16 converting mp3 files into MPEG 1 which screech when playing !

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/17/2019, 3:27 AM

The Properties of the Blu Ray disc show a bit rate of 18.000. The video defaults are MPEG-2, 16:9 aspect, 1920 x 1080 Resolution Frame rate 25 interlaced.

EricLNZ wrote on 9/17/2019, 6:12 AM

The Properties of the Blu Ray disc show a bit rate of 18.000. The video defaults are MPEG-2, 16:9 aspect, 1920 x 1080 Resolution Frame rate 25 interlaced.

Yes, but what is the bitrate of the actual files. Presumably you used a standard Main Concept MPEG-2 Blu-ray template when exporting your files from VMS to use in DVDA. What is the average and maximum bitrates shown in the render template? Is it as below

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/17/2019, 7:54 PM

My setting are same as your screenshot.

EricLNZ wrote on 9/17/2019, 8:58 PM

Thanks, two comments.

  1. Is there a reason you are using mpeg-2 not avc? Mpeg-2 is an old codec designed in standard definition days. Avc/Mpeg-4 is more modern and, according to what I've read, has much better compression than mpeg-2 giving better quality at comparable bitrates.
  2. This recent thread could be relevant. Perhaps your max bitrate of 30,000 kbps on a burnt disc is too high for players to handle and they freeze when they encounter it. Personally I've customised a Magix AVC/AAC MP4 template to give a video stream of 20,000 kbps CBR as below. A file from this should not get recompressed by DVDA and shouldn't give player problems.

Whilst I find VMS and DVDA great software VMS is a cut down version of Vegas Pro and, in my opinion, contains traps for us consumer hobbyists compared to other software which are designed ground up for the consumer. The unrealistic bitrates for Blu-ray exports to be used in burnt discs is an example. DVDA has given me a warning of this if the average bitrate is above (I think) 28,000 kbs. But it doesn't give a warning of high maximum bitrates.

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/17/2019, 10:14 PM

Thanks for info.. I only recently got upgrade to VMS16 from VMS 13 and so used the simple Make Movie and Burn to Blu Ray with menu option and took whatever it did!! . VMS13 dispensed with the Render As option, but I now see it is back in VMS 16, so I can now try with my choice of render settings and see what difference it makes. I had been frustrated with the Make Movie option which did not allow a preset template unless rendering to Hard Drive. I will follow your suggestions and advise what is the outcome. Thanks a lot.

EricLNZ wrote on 9/17/2019, 11:14 PM

Of course you need to render to your hard drive both separate video and audio streams which you can then import into DVDA.

For rendering from VMSPlat16 I use "Make Movie" then "Save it to my Hard Drive" then "Advanced Options" which brings in the templates.

Grandpabaj wrote on 9/17/2019, 11:23 PM

Thanks.. I have just realized that is the best way. Have been 'lazy' in past !! with 'one click option' !!