Trim without render?

Hitest wrote on 3/22/2021, 5:35 PM

I have a specific file I want to edit by cutting the video at the beginning and end of the content. I can get this file into my video track, but do I have to render it after editing, or is there a way to just cut the unwanted content and save my file again as an MPG? (The initial file was also an MPG. I ask because I think rendering diminishes the quality of the initial video. Can I somehow just trim unwanted content and save the new content as an MPG without rendering the file? BTW my OS in Windows 8.1.Thanks

Comments

Jack S wrote on 3/22/2021, 5:44 PM

@Hitest The short answer is 'No'. I use 'Avidemux' in Copy mode when I want to do what you want to do. However, the cut points must be made on an I-Frame to avoid corruption.

My system
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Hitest wrote on 3/22/2021, 6:21 PM

Does Avidemux support many different video formats? MP4? MPG? Thanks

Jack S wrote on 3/23/2021, 6:15 AM

@Hitest It does, but I'm not sure that they all work in Copy mode. Why don't you download it and give it a try?

My system
Genshin Infinity Gaming PC
Motherboard Gigabyte H610M H: m-ATX w/, USB 3.2, 1 x M.2
Power Supply Corsair RM750X
Intel Core i7-13700K - 16-Core [8P @ 3.4GHz-5.4GHz / 8E @ 2.50GHz-4.20GHz]
30MB Cache + UHD Graphics, Ultimate OC Compatible
Case Fan 4 x CyberPowerPC Hyperloop 120mm ARGB & PWM Fan Kit
CPU Fan CyberPowerPC Master Liquid LITE 360 ARGB AIO Liquid Cooler, Ultimate OC Compatible
Memory 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR5/5200MHz Corsair Vengeance RGB
MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti 8GB - Ray Tracing Technology, DX12, VR Ready, HDMI, DP
System drive 1TB WD Black SN770 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD - 5150MB/s Read & 4900MB/s Write
Storage 2 x 2TB Seagate BarraCuda SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 7200RPM
Windows 11 Home (x64)
Monitors
Generic Monitor (PHL 222V8) connected to GeForce RTX 4060 Ti
Generic Monitor (SAMSUNG) connected to iGPU

Camcorder
SONY Handycam HDR-XR550VE

Musicvid wrote on 3/24/2021, 7:14 AM

Actually, you can smart render mpeg-2 video in Vegas. Only the last few frames will be re-encoded unless you cut on an I-frame..

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/does-re-rendering-hit-the-quality-of-the-video--104149/#ca643508

Hitest wrote on 3/24/2021, 10:42 AM

Actually, you can smart render mpeg-2 video in Vegas. Only the last few frames will be re-encoded unless you cut on an I-frame..

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/does-re-rendering-hit-the-quality-of-the-video--104149/#ca643508

So I assume rather then using make movie button I would use the render as feature and this would fast render my project? I am using Vegas Movie Studio 9.0b (build 92), how can I determine if I am on an I frame or another frame when I cut? Thanks

Musicvid wrote on 3/26/2021, 4:46 PM

I would use the render as feature and this would fast render my project? 

As long as every single parameter exactly matches the source. Every one of those parameters is set by you. they are not automatic, and they are not easy.

how can I determine if I am on an I frame or another frame when I cut? 

Sorry I brought it up; don't worry about it.

Hitest wrote on 3/26/2021, 5:18 PM

I can select a frame in the track and it will show me the picture in video preview but it doesn't tell me if it's an I frame or a B frame or a P frame. I also need to find out how to set the exact mpeg parameters, the drop down menu selects an MPEG profile as a default fro mp2, but it doesn't match the profile of the file I want to edit.

anthony-chiappette wrote on 3/30/2021, 8:57 PM

Do you have the option, when creating a new project, to base the project setting on a specific video? I know the later versions on MSP allow this, not sire about the older versions. I shoot on Dual Cannon video cameras at 60FPS progressive, and I start all my projects using the match video settings. Only difference is MSP only allows maximum bitrate of 28Mbps, whereas my camera shoots at 35Mbps. Even still, my edited videos render in just a little faster than real time. A 5 minute video renders in about 4 min 30 seconds to MP4, which is the format the videos from the camera are.

ASUS Prime Z590-A Motherboard with Intel Core i7 11700 8 Core / 16 Thread 2.50GHZ, 64GB Crucial DDR4 3200( 4 x 16GB), nVidia GeForce GTX1650Super 4GB DDR5, SoundBlaster X AE5 soundcard, 3 x 4TB Samsung 860 EVO SATA 3 SSD, 2 x 8TB Samsung 870 QVO SATA 3 SSD, 1 x 2TB Samsung 980 Pro NVME PICE4 SSD, 2 X WD 4 TB NVME PCIE3 SSD, 2 X Viewsonic monitors, LG Blu-Ray writer. Windows 11 (latest build), currently using Vegas Pro Edit 22 latest build.

Hitest wrote on 3/31/2021, 9:01 AM

Do you have the option, when creating a new project, to base the project setting on a specific video? I know the later versions on MSP allow this, not sire about the older versions. I shoot on Dual Cannon video cameras at 60FPS progressive, and I start all my projects using the match video settings. Only difference is MSP only allows maximum bitrate of 28Mbps, whereas my camera shoots at 35Mbps. Even still, my edited videos render in just a little faster than real time. A 5 minute video renders in about 4 min 30 seconds to MP4, which is the format the videos from the camera are.

Hi there, when I look at the properties of the Mpg file I want to edit, it tells me the video settings are frame width 720/ height 480 /data rate 9100kbps/total bitrate 9350kbps/ frame rate 29 frames/second. I can't see any setting specifically to match output video to the video I have inserted onto the track. I do have some text in the video preview tab that says: Project 720X480X32, 29.970p, and Preview 720X480X32, 29.970p, but .

I also see in the video preview tab a button for project video properties, and it allows me to set width/height, field order/pixel aspect ratio/and frame rate, and 2 drop down boxes for resolution rendering quality and deinterlace method. So if there is an option to match the rendered video to the input video format, I don't see it. I think I have to match it up manually, and have done so with the settings 720X480,29.970 fps.

My goal is I don't want Vegas studio to re render the entire video, because i think doing so degrades the quality (am I right about this?). I just want to do some cuts on the start and end of the video and have it resave the newly trimmed MPEG file. I am told I can do this using the render as function (how is render as different from the make movie button?) But I need to make sure I do my cuts on an I frame and not a B or P frame, but I can't find any place where vegas movie studio will tell me what type of frame I have selected in the track. Any ideas? Thanks

Musicvid wrote on 3/31/2021, 9:24 AM

@Hitest

Here is how it works. And yes, it still works afaik.

https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/does-re-rendering-hit-the-quality-of-the-video--104149/#ca643465

I'm sure you know that any frames that have titles, transitions, effects, pan/crop, compositing, or opacity changes will not smart-render because they are not the original frames.

Hitest wrote on 3/31/2021, 9:45 AM

Ok, thanks for that, but according to the link you sent, it says "Enable no-recompress rendering - Select this check box if you want to pass through unedited frames without recompression." This sounds like what I want to do, but In my version of Vegas movie studio I can't find any such option. The closest I come to this is under preferences, and preview device tab, I have a box that says "Recompress edited frames" This option is currently checked. Should I leave this box checked or uncheck it? What do you think? Thanks.

Btw I wanted to attach a screen snapshot of my preferences screen but this website has no option to do that.

Musicvid wrote on 3/31/2021, 10:00 AM

I don't have Vegas Movie Studio 9.0b, a 12 year old version, so I can't tell you. Good luck.

vkmast wrote on 3/31/2021, 10:02 AM

This website has the option (Upload file), used regularly here. And my Win10 still has the Snipping Tool.  

Hitest wrote on 3/31/2021, 10:13 AM

Yes, you are correct, I will attach my screen snapshot to a reply to Musicvid, Don't know how I missed this before. Many thanks

Hitest wrote on 3/31/2021, 10:15 AM

I don't have Vegas Movie Studio 9.0b, a 12 year old version, so I can't tell you. Good luck.

vkmast advised me on how to attach a screen snapshot, so here is the only place I can find that mentions recompressing frames. As you can see, the box is currently checked. Should I uncheck it? Thanks

Marco. wrote on 3/31/2021, 10:25 AM

This is the preview preference which is not related to rendering. The preference related to rendering is to be found in Options/Preferences/General.

Musicvid wrote on 3/31/2021, 10:51 AM

+1

Hitest wrote on 3/31/2021, 11:04 AM

+1

?

Hitest wrote on 3/31/2021, 11:11 AM

This is the preview preference which is not related to rendering. The preference related to rendering is to be found in Options/Preferences/General.

Sorry if you got this twice, here is a screen snapshot of my options/preferences/general screen. I can't really see anything in here related to video compression on render. Am I missing something? Thanks

Musicvid wrote on 3/31/2021, 11:19 AM

No, you are not missing anything, except that you have a version that is older than the one referenced in my link.

Feel free to experiment, make mistakes, and when you see a black screen with white letters "No Recompression Required," you will have reached the right place.

The first time I attempted this, it took me exactly 1,784 trials before I got it right. That's how tricky it can be. So perhaps VideoRedo is better suited to your needs, because matching templates are included in a simpler GUI. Let us know when you've got it!

Hitest wrote on 3/31/2021, 12:00 PM

No, you are not missing anything, except that you have a version that is older than the one referenced in my link.

Feel free to experiment, make mistakes, and when you see a black screen with white letters "No Recompression Required," you will have reached the right place.

The first time I attempted this, it took me exactly 1,784 trials before I got it right. That's how tricky it can be. So perhaps VideoRedo is better suited to your needs, because matching templates are included in a simpler GUI. Let us know when you've got it!

I'm thinking it's possible that the older version that I have does not offer no recompressions rendering? (although there is a render as option) I'm sure there are many programs that would do this better and easier, but since I paid for this product, I am investigating if it is possible to do this with my version of Vegas movie studio. I'm hoping it is but if not I will take a look at VideoRedo. I do have a support ticket in with them, but it's been 3 days now and so far no response. If I ever do get an answer from the support team and it is anything substantial I will share that answer with the forum, in case others are interested. Thanks for the suggestions.

vkmast wrote on 3/31/2021, 1:06 PM

Please see this old comment which seems somewhat related.

Musicvid wrote on 3/31/2021, 2:08 PM

I'm thinking it's possible that the older version that I have does not offer no recompressions rendering? 

It was available then. There are references to mpeg-2 smart render on this forum going back to 2003, about the time I joined. Again, it is not easy. Do let us know how it turns out.