SCC is the most common form of closed captioning for broadcast TV. Earlier versions of Vegas under Sony could read embedded SCC fine. All Vegas Pro versions can make the same embedded SCC files. As mentioned before, Vegas Pro can read the sidecar SCC files fine, but if you don't have it, and just the embedded video file, then you would have to use an earlier version of Vegas or some other software. The current problem is likely just an oversight on the part of Magix that I hope they will soon fix.

This is from the Vegas Pro 18 help file:

Importing or rendering closed captions in an MXF or MPEG-2 file

Importing captions

VEGAS Pro supports closed captioning embedded in XDCAM HD/XDCAM HD422 MXF and MPEG-2 files. ATSC and SCTE formats are supported when reading captions in MPEG-2 files.

When you add media to the timeline or Trimmer, embedded captioning markers are displayed as media markers:

Looks like it should be reading embedded closed captioning the same as previous versions. I don't have any files handy to test with, though.

I stand corrected. Thanks for the information; I hadn't really gotten under the surface, since VP14 always opens, previews, and passes 608 from my recorded ATSC files correctly without intervention. My recorded streams contain both 608 and 708 text streams.

Here's what the VP14 Help says:

Closed captions help make your video productions accessible to a wider audience. Closed captions are widely used by viewers who are deaf or hard of hearing, those who are learning to read, or who are learning a second language.

Closed captions can be turned on or off by the viewer (unlike open captions, which are always displayed). Closed captions display spoken dialogue and sound effects as on-screen text.

Notes:

Vegas Pro supports CEA608 captions and CEA708 containers containing CEA608 captions.

When rendering to XDCAM HD/HD422, CEA608 data is uplifted to CEA708 format so that CEA608 and CEA708 captions are available when playing via HD SDI. CEA608 CC1 is uplifted to CEA708 Service 1, and CEA608 CC3 is uplifted to CEA708 Service 2. Please note that caption positions can be slightly different after uplifting to CEA708.

When you render to a format that does not support embedded captioning markers, an .SCC file is created using the base name of the rendered media file.

I just tested these and they all seem correct, including the last sentence, which I didn't know before. If your VP18 is behaving differently, you may have identified a bug and may wish to title your thread accordingly.

@jetdv Here is a link to a recorded 1 minute file that conains four subtitle tracks: only the first one (608) appears to be populated; maybe you can figure out what's up with VP18.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1X50vj9CygGFCCnvsV889-VFDUhoM6pZD/view?usp=sharing

@Blaine-WItherow

Vegas Pro 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, and* 15 will create the .scc file after mapping the embedded information in the stream. After opening in any of those versions and letting the earlier version generate the .scc file, Vegas Pro 17 and 18 will open and display the information. Stop me if this a "big duh" statement.

Vegas Pro 17

Vegas Pro 18

* I don't have Vegas Pro 16.

I know it creates both embedded and sidecar scc in MXF files which my broadcasters require (608). You will find that if you have just the video file with embedded scc (and no sidecar scc), the newer versions of Vegas Pro cannot read the scc. As mentioned before, early versions by Sony would. I still use Vegas Pro 11 for some things, but have most versions up to 18.

Responding to an old-ish thread here, but there is no such thing as an "embedded" SCC file. An SCC file is just that - a file; one that contains text with timecode and CC data in hexadecimal form. You can use an SCC file to embed CC into a video file, in a number of ways. SD files can contain "legacy" line 21 EIA-608 captions. QuickTime files can contain their own CC data. MPEG-2, including MPEG-2 video streams contained in an MXF file, can contain MPEG-2 "User Data" CC in VANC (a.k.a. ATSC A/53 CC, or DTVCC). MXF files (MPEG-2 or otherwise) can also contain what is called a SMPTE 436M track which can place CC in its own stream (separate from the video stream, but still contained within the MXF file wrapper).

Vegas can read line 21 EIA-608 and CEA608 (SD version of CEA708) captions embedded in video files, but reading CEA708 (HD) captions is limited, if it exists at all within Vegas. And despite what Vegas says about "uplifting" 608 captions to 708, it is broken. Vegas can generate a 708 caption track, but there are never any valid captions contained in it. Either there are no captions at all, or there are garbled captions that appear for only split second. This is, again, the case for 708 captions; 608 captions embedded in the same file (which will be included for backwards compatibility in HD files) will be ok. This is a bug in Vegas that goes back many versions.

Further info on 608/708 captions can be found here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEA-708

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EIA-608

Hope this provides some clarity to this thread.

Thanks, this is good info. Sorry for saying embedding SCC rather than embedding CC. MusicVid sent a 1minute test file that I couldn't even open in Vegas. Switch Plus indicated would read cc in it, but on one hand said it was 608, and on the other 708, or maybe it had both. Premiere did not detect any cc but did play it. So far the broadcasters I work with have been okay with the files I have sent made by Vegas, but I am concerned that that may change. Vegas would do closed captioning back with version 10, so they were a way ahead of others, but have not developed it at all since. I sure hope they do soon.

If you have the means (Google Drive link or similar) to send me the problem file, I could take a look at it, and possibly offer some suggestions. I wouldn't hold my breath on Vegas getting improved CC support anytime soon. They seem to be focusing more on supporting content creation features than broadcast-related features.

EDIT: No need to send the problem file - I see it was posted earlier in the thread (I read slowly). I've shared my "fix" for that file below

As a TV broadcaster myself, I make 608 CC embedded .mxf files in Vegas, then equipment in my broadcast chain automatically ups it to 608 + 708.

The way Vegas handles 708 (or DOESN'T handle it) is a real thorn in my side!

Lack of 708 support is annoying, I agree.

One issue for which I have found a workaround is the occasional file for which Vegas will *not* read the embedded 608 captions. @Musicvid posted one such file above, which I could not get either VP13 or VP15 to read without using ffmpeg to re-wrap. And, in fact, I had to re-wrap to MPEG Program Stream rather than MPEG Transport Stream to get it to work *with* captions. So, that's the occasionally necessary workaround for missing captions - re-wrap to Program Stream. Here is the syntax to do that, in case anyone ever reads this and wants to try (input.mts is the example input file):

ffmpeg -i input.mts -c copy -f dvd output.mpg

Good information.

In cases where there are bad broadcast stream errors, rewrapping alone may not complete the job. I'm a big fan of VideoRedo, which fixes broken GOPs, reindexes, an resync the audio, in addition to regular muxing and commercial removal.

I assume that if any of you tested my problem reading embedded captions in MXF (without a sidecar scc file present), you would also find that it will not work.

Otherwise, it would be good to find a economical solution to embed 708 captions in mxf files.

I assume that if any of you tested my problem reading embedded captions in MXF (without a sidecar scc file present), you would also find that it will not work.

Otherwise, it would be good to find a economical solution to embed 708 captions in mxf files.

EDIT: I need to learn to fully read/comprehend... MXF files that contain 608 captions (or maybe 708) in a 436M (aka CDP) format should work, and I can verify that that they do work in Vegas 15 for at least some sample MXF files. If the MXF file contains DTVCC captions, Vegas will not read them. If you have a sample file to send, I can do some analysis and try to assist.

As for an economical solution for inserting 708 MXF captions, if you're willing to put up with AWS, one might be https://aws.amazon.com/mediaconvert/

About 3 cents per minute of video.

The mxf files I was talking about were made with Vegas Pro. You could test yourself if you have Vegas by making a short clip with closed captioning embedded. I'll enclose a link for a couple of short samples.

https://tribaltrails.blob.core.windows.net/tempfiles/TestSampleTTrails.mxf

https://tribaltrails.blob.core.windows.net/tempfiles/16secSampleCCembedded.mxf

I'll check out mediaconvert.

The problem with these files was that for you Vegas was unable to read the captions in the files, correct?

I'm not seeing that issue. Vegas 15 is able to read them.

That's right. Vegas Pro 16, 17 and 18 will not read embedded closed captions. (Vegas Pro 11, 12 and 15 will, probably 13 & 14 too.). Internal Preferences for enabling reading of closed captions is TRUE.

That is definitely a bug. I just reproduced the problem in a trial of VP18. Sorry I threw a bunch of extraneous information at you only to come to the same conclusion you did. Since I do not own a copy of VP16-18, I guess I don't have standing to try to contact support about this bug. And it looks like Magix is making it increasingly hard to submit a support ticket... This is disappointing.

I was able to track down this email address which you could try (if you haven't already): infoservice@magix.net

Ask Support is here. A user-created tutorial is here. A pinned post.

I can verify that V12 can read the CC provided by Blaine-Wltherow's samples.

CC Extractor can also retrieve them.

Ask Support is here. A user-created tutorial is here. A pinned post.

I appreciate the tutorial, but I'll echo another user's comment that they have added far too many hoops through which to jump.

I can verify that V12 can read the CC provided by Blaine-Wltherow's samples.

CC Extractor can also retrieve them.

That's good info. I didn't realize that they had added MXF support; they're on version 88 and I lasted touched it on version 75. If they could add SCC extraction (which includes position info), they'd really have all the bases covered, but I know you can only ask so much from freeware developers.